International Full Size Jeep Association
Home Forums Reader's Rigs Tech Library Trail Stories FSJ-List
International Full Size Jeep Association  

Go Back   International Full Size Jeep Association > Tire Kickin' > Off-Road FSJ Tech

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-17-2006, 04:04 AM
wickedwagon767's Avatar
wickedwagon767 wickedwagon767 is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Dec 26, 2005
Location: DFW
Posts: 1,932
modified Quadratrac differential with money back guarantee!

OK

I don't know if anyone has dealt with this guy or not. If anyone has,let us know.

www.willys.net

They offer a stock rebuilt Quadratrac differential
and a "severe service" version with unknown internals and both are priced at $325 + $125 core

I emailed the operator of the site with questions regarding their method of rebuild on both versions and this is his response

" Thanks for your inquiry. The rebuilt units are rebuilt with used components. The shop that builds my transmisiions, transfers, and axles also does the Q/T differentials. The results so far have been quite good. Each internal part is thoroughly cleaned and then closely inspected. The last two rebuilt units I shipped required the tear down of 7 differentials to have enough good parts to build 2.

Now, the severe service units. The same shop also does these units. The mechanic that does all of my rebuilds is very deeply involved in drag racing and he is the guy responsible for the development of this series. While I won't tell you exactly what he has done, I will promise, guarantee, and swear that, 1. There are no welded parts involved. 2. None of the original internals are used. 3. You will break u-joints and twist drive shafts before you break this unit. 4. Drag racing technology is used. 5. Q/T fluid is not necessary. 6. This is not a modified Mile Marker conversion, strength-wise Mile Marker is not even in the running. 7. If any of these declarations are found to be false, I will refund the purchase price and the shipping costs and you can keep the unit. 'Nuff said.

I hope you find the answers satisfactory. Because of the time and money spent developing the severe service unit, I choose not to give exact details, I hope you understand.

George "

Everyone get that? Money back guarantee on this differential if it breaks before your u-joints and 'shafts. Now, I'm sure the strength of the chain might need to be factored in,because it might go before anything. I really don't know exactly how strong Quadratrac chains are. And on the site the need for manual locking hubs is recommended if the vehicles with "severe service" diffs are driven on the street at all,but they are not recommended for street use.

I emailed him again with more questions regarding the function of the "severe service" diff

I will post his response when I get it

anyone have any idea what "drag racing technology" might be used in these units that he's making seem like " privelaged" information?

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-17-2006, 06:32 AM
scotty's Avatar
scotty scotty is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 12, 2000
Location: dayton,oh,45431
Posts: 6,627
"severe service unit"? "drag racing technology"? sounds pretty cheesy to me. the shop,the mechanic,or someone must have a nice machine shop to make whatever they have replaced the diff with if they dont use any welded parts or any of the original internals.

it would be interesting to buy one and take it apart to see what is going on inside one,but i personally dont care enuff about the QTs to spend that kinda $$ on one. although,if he really backs his gaurantee im sure i could break it and get my $$ back i find it very hard to believe that an aluminum case with a chain driving both outputs is going to survive the breaking of u joints and/or twisting driveshafts. the QT chain is fat,and very strong as chains go, but it IS running both the outputs,and wears quickly. especially when big tires and abuse are involved. with a new chain im sure it will hold up for awhile,but it will eventually break the chaaain,start skipping teeth or break the case in half, and i will gaurantee that

"Because of the time and money spent developing the severe service unit, I choose not to give exact details"

guy is quite a salesman,anyway.maybe we should take up a collection and buy one. id be happy to tear it down and post pics of whatever wizardry and magic is involved.
__________________
scotty
85 grand wagoneer
258/t18/d20/10 bolt/14 bolt
38" TSL SXs
chopped,bobbed and caged

http://nightcrawlers4wd.20megsfree.com/index.html\

http://mytrailrigs4x4.20megsfree.com/photo.html\
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-17-2006, 08:14 AM
rustywagoneers_com's Avatar
rustywagoneers_com rustywagoneers_com is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Feb 02, 2006
Location: dodge, NE
Posts: 2,334
sounds like spool or mini-spool to me....

peace
Dave
__________________
There is no way to rule innocent men.
The only power government has is the power to crack down on criminals.
Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them.
One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-17-2006, 08:24 AM
jode's Avatar
jode jode is offline
JB Welder
 
Join Date: Apr 08, 2002
Location: Midway, Utah
Posts: 6,376
Quote:
Originally Posted by rustywagoneers_com
sounds like spool or mini-spool to me....

Exactly what I was thinking when he said no QT fluiod and manual hubs are recommended....
__________________
No FSJs for the time being - "I'm working on it, I'm working on it" (think Mike Meyers' SNL skit about the gut)
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-17-2006, 08:26 AM
Lindel's Avatar
Lindel Lindel is offline
Perfesser of Jeepology
 
Join Date: Jun 15, 2000
Location: Carpentersville, IL 60110
Posts: 9,204
He does state that it can be used on-road "in an emergency", on his website. I'm not planning on buying the severe duty, or the standard diff either for that matter, I've got a working QT at the moment, and a spare, just in case.
__________________
Jeep Grounds
RRV Homepage
Texas Full Size Jeep Association
1987 Grand Wagoneer
AMC 360/TF727/NP229
1999 Wrangler Sport
4.0L/AX-15/NV231


Quote:
“Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction” by Ronald Reagan.


Formerly of DFW/Gun Barrel City, TX - eventually to return...
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-17-2006, 08:29 AM
KaiserMan's Avatar
KaiserMan KaiserMan is offline
I got the Willys....
 
Join Date: Jun 21, 2005
Location: Huntington, Ma.
Posts: 8,699
Hmmm, rebuilt with used parts. Not willing to disclose whats inside his "severe service" version. That right is enough to put me off. Not to mention for the $325+ core price you can go buy a NP205 and have cash left over. It would be interesting to find out whats inside, but not $325 interesting. Also interesting that both versions are priced the same.
__________________
Thomas Russell
1987 Cherokee Laredo 2-Door 4.0/AW4
1971 Gladiator
J2000 Platform-Stake Dump 350/T18

1970 Gladiator J3000 3407Z Camper Truck 350/T18
1968 Wagoneer Custom 327/TH400

Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-17-2006, 08:55 AM
wickedwagon767's Avatar
wickedwagon767 wickedwagon767 is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Dec 26, 2005
Location: DFW
Posts: 1,932
Unless he had a patent pending , I told him I thought it was a little odd being excessively secretive about an apparently "revolutionary" idea for a 27+ year old T-case design. If it is in fact a spool , that would not justify $325 for it. Scotty is right " Drag Race Technology" ? Come on. He also said dissasembling the unit would void the warranty......but if any of his claims in testament to the diff were proven false he would refund not only the purchase price,but the shipping cost AND you can keep the unit.

Sounds a little to good to be true. If so much was invested in R&D to keep the details secret......why give basically every unit away for free? Because everyone could potentially say it broke or malfunctioned....what is he going to do, have you to ship him the broken diff to prove its damaged and then ship you back the unusable diff carcas?

If we get 32 members to chip in 10 bucks and have someone supply a differential core we could put an end to this speculation and send the "severe service" diff to Scotty for a stint on the operating table.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-17-2006, 11:30 AM
kyrel kyrel is offline
Grease Monkey
 
Join Date: Dec 02, 2000
Location: Middltown, Oh
Posts: 295
I have 2 for cores let me know if people want to do this and I will keep one of them around,,,if not I am going to scrap them...
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-17-2006, 12:35 PM
FSJ Guy FSJ Guy is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 20, 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,061
I saw his website before, too. sure sounds like a Spool inside, to be. All you'd have to do is machine something that attached to the center spider gear pin and engaged the output shaft splines. Bingo. No OEM internals and most likely, pretty beefy. Is it worth $325? Sure, if you can no longer get the MM kit anymore. But, since you can.....

Besides, why not show what's inside? Every other locker manufacturer shows you EXACTLY how their product works.

Sounds fishy. I've got better things to spend that kind of money on.
__________________
Ethan Brady
1987 Grand Wagoneer, slightly longer than stock.

www.bigscaryjeep.com

Don't mess with me. I once killed a living hinge.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-17-2006, 12:48 PM
jode's Avatar
jode jode is offline
JB Welder
 
Join Date: Apr 08, 2002
Location: Midway, Utah
Posts: 6,376
If Scotty (or actually any member with one tons and QT) is down with the idea, I'll comitt $10 to see if he/they can break it

Sounds like a good one to submit to FSJ magazine as a tech article...if 32 people comitt, I will send the $$
__________________
No FSJs for the time being - "I'm working on it, I'm working on it" (think Mike Meyers' SNL skit about the gut)
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-17-2006, 07:05 PM
shackwrrr's Avatar
shackwrrr shackwrrr is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Mar 04, 2006
Location: Lima,Ohio/Piedmont, Ohio
Posts: 3,145
well a spool is "drag racing tecnology"
__________________
Jeepless

In to Turbo crap now
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-18-2006, 03:57 AM
wickedwagon767's Avatar
wickedwagon767 wickedwagon767 is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Dec 26, 2005
Location: DFW
Posts: 1,932
lol yes. Just goes to show how people can re-package an old product and try to make it 'sound' new and wonderous
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-18-2006, 04:04 AM
wickedwagon767's Avatar
wickedwagon767 wickedwagon767 is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Dec 26, 2005
Location: DFW
Posts: 1,932
Here is the second reply from the guy

" I will provide a written guarantee. The only thing that voids any warranty or guarantee other than water damage, is if the unit is disassembled.

It is fully locked at all times, and is not available otherwise. Street use would require locking hubs, and that, as you know, only disengages the wheels. The front driveshaft and ring and pinion, always turn. That is why I stress "necessary" on the website, concerning street driving.

To date, the feedback has been very good. The thing to keep in mind is that the units in use now are being used in offroad only vehicles. One guy in south Florida is mud racing a Wagoneer, and not talking about why his Q/T is holding up so well.

I will have to call my trans. guy to find out when he can have a unit ready.

George "


Now, to me, it seems like having the inner diff fully locked in a Quadratrac would increase the stress on the chain and other wear-related parts.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-18-2006, 05:00 AM
Lindel's Avatar
Lindel Lindel is offline
Perfesser of Jeepology
 
Join Date: Jun 15, 2000
Location: Carpentersville, IL 60110
Posts: 9,204
It wouldn't put anymore strain on the case than being in e-drive all the time, and as long as it's on dirt, no problems.

I'm guessing it's a spool, not a "differential".
__________________
Jeep Grounds
RRV Homepage
Texas Full Size Jeep Association
1987 Grand Wagoneer
AMC 360/TF727/NP229
1999 Wrangler Sport
4.0L/AX-15/NV231


Quote:
“Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction” by Ronald Reagan.


Formerly of DFW/Gun Barrel City, TX - eventually to return...
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-18-2006, 06:18 AM
Donzi's Avatar
Donzi Donzi is offline
232 I6
 
Join Date: May 03, 2006
Location: Sweden
Posts: 52
I think this is the same George that ran Kelly's, a 4x4 shop in the New Orleans area. I thought he was a a crook and a weasel from the brief dealings I have had with him but thats just my opinion...
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 05-18-2006, 07:21 AM
fulsizjeep's Avatar
fulsizjeep fulsizjeep is offline
Señor Jackhead
 
Join Date: Aug 21, 2002
Location: Jubilee Jeeps.SWCO
Posts: 22,491
I hooked up with this guy 2 or 3 years ago and he told me purty much the same thing. I just was not willing to gamble the money when I can still get QTs cheap enough to take 7 to build 2. I would be really interested in seeing a break down of the severe service unit too.
__________________
Flint
Ran when parked.
http://jubileejeeps.org/quadratrac
88 GW, 401/727/208, 5" lift, D44s/4.10s/locked up, 35s with a few Evil Twin & TT's Fabworks mods
76 401 Wag, 77 401 Wag, 77 401 J20
http://eviltwinfab.com http://www.ttsfabworks.com
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-18-2006, 07:26 AM
shimniok's Avatar
shimniok shimniok is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Jan 08, 2003
Location: Centennial, Colorado
Posts: 2,907
QT > ujoints, driveshaft

Quote:
Originally Posted by scotty
"severe service unit"? "drag racing technology"? sounds pretty cheesy to me.

...

i find it very hard to believe that an aluminum case with a chain driving both outputs is going to survive the breaking of u joints and/or twisting driveshafts.


I think I know what he's doing but I'm not telling cuz I want to experiment and try it myself.

Having just witnessed a stock driveshaft twist the end off on a NP229-equipped FSJ with oem axles and 35's on Golden Spike, I'm going to have to beg to differ.



Ok, sure, the 229 doesn't drive both outputs with a chain. Point taken. I still think that u-joints and driveshafts are weaker... but what do I know.

Michael
__________________
Broken Photobucket image in my post? PM me.
1986 Grand Wagoneer "Troubled Child"tc.wagoneer.orgFacebook • KØFSJ
Stock 360, TBI, 727 with TransGo, NP208, 4" Skyjacker, 33" BFG MT, WT Axles, Lock Right & ARB, OBA
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-18-2006, 07:35 AM
fulsizjeep's Avatar
fulsizjeep fulsizjeep is offline
Señor Jackhead
 
Join Date: Aug 21, 2002
Location: Jubilee Jeeps.SWCO
Posts: 22,491
This is a twister from a 229 too...both end pieces of this shaft looked the same after the WHAM...Tcase had over 200K on it and survived 2 more years until it went kapoot on Poison Spider.

Just to support the nay sayers and leave more for me, I think Quadratracs are junk and will chunk a chain at the first sign of severe use. There, I said it.
__________________
Flint
Ran when parked.
http://jubileejeeps.org/quadratrac
88 GW, 401/727/208, 5" lift, D44s/4.10s/locked up, 35s with a few Evil Twin & TT's Fabworks mods
76 401 Wag, 77 401 Wag, 77 401 J20
http://eviltwinfab.com http://www.ttsfabworks.com
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-18-2006, 07:44 AM
scotty's Avatar
scotty scotty is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 12, 2000
Location: dayton,oh,45431
Posts: 6,627
Quote:
Originally Posted by shimniok
Having just witnessed a stock driveshaft twist the end off on a NP229-equipped FSJ with oem axles and 35's on Golden Spike, I'm going to have to beg to differ.



Ok, sure, the 229 doesn't drive both outputs with a chain. Point taken. I still think that u-joints and driveshafts are weaker... but what do I know.

Michael

that is one of those "exceptions that prove the rule" you comment here also insinuates that the 229 is stronger than the dana 44s,and that 44s are strong enuff for 35s,wich we all know is debatable.

trust me,the 229 is not a case that you want to abuse. they do not often twist off outputs so its possible to break a driveshaft,but i have seen plenty of 229s with broken/cracked case halves and general breakage of internals.

check the fluid on a regular basis. when it starts to come out silvery youll know its on its way out-this means the magic silicone filled viscous coupleing is cracked.broken and leaking out the magic silicone fluid. eventually it will split and the case will become hard/impossible to shift,in a best case. a worse case youll be picking peaces of it up off the ground
__________________
scotty
85 grand wagoneer
258/t18/d20/10 bolt/14 bolt
38" TSL SXs
chopped,bobbed and caged

http://nightcrawlers4wd.20megsfree.com/index.html\

http://mytrailrigs4x4.20megsfree.com/photo.html\

Last edited by scotty : 05-18-2006 at 07:47 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-18-2006, 07:49 AM
scotty's Avatar
scotty scotty is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 12, 2000
Location: dayton,oh,45431
Posts: 6,627
Quote:
Originally Posted by fulsizjeep
Just to support the nay sayers and leave more for me, I think Quadratracs are junk and will chunk a chain at the first sign of severe use. There, I said it.

for the record,i never said the b/w QT was junk. it was a basically good unit if properly maintened and well ahead of its time for a full time transfer case.

if your talking about the 229 being junk,youre right,and you can have every one of them
__________________
scotty
85 grand wagoneer
258/t18/d20/10 bolt/14 bolt
38" TSL SXs
chopped,bobbed and caged

http://nightcrawlers4wd.20megsfree.com/index.html\

http://mytrailrigs4x4.20megsfree.com/photo.html\
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
corner corner