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  #1  
Old 08-23-2021, 12:00 PM
rang-a-stang's Avatar
rang-a-stang rang-a-stang is offline
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Join Date: Oct 31, 2016
Location: Camarillo, CA
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When is a rig "Built" not "Bought"

So I was cruising around SoCal yesterday and saw the stereotypical college girl Jeep (that's what my son calls this style; we've all seen it):
LEDS EVERYWHERE
polished aluminum 20" rims
scowling grill
A bright red high lift jack mounted in the most conspicuous place possible
Bright red D-rings on the front and back, clanging away as they drive
etc. etc. etc.
I think we all get license to do what we want with our rigs. College girl style is not my style but my style also isn't most other peoples style so set that aside, just setting the scene, I guess.

What made the one I was looking at pique my interest was on the back window it had a "Built not bought" sticker. So I started looking a little closer thinking maybe this one was a little different. I started looking at the undercarriage to see if there was any fabrication; None that I could see. Maybe gears and a locker were installed; rear diff cover looked like it had never been removed. I even saw what looked like stock JK Exhaust.

I started thinking "PSHHHH! Built??! What's 'built' on that?!" But the other side of me said "What's built about your turd? You just fix things that break. how is that anymore built than that JK?"

Hm... When I think "Built not Bought" my head goes 3 ways:
a) a ground up resto where everything came apart and went back together. Upgrades are irrelevant here. They got a starter vehicle and completely went through it.
b) A vehicle that was modified to do something that it was never really meant to do. So a Honda Civic that runs 10's in the quartermile. A rock crawling Wagoneer. A Baja bug. A Narrow Track Cherokee with a Hemi swap.
c) A car assembled from pretty much all new parts. So a Factory 5 Cobra Replica, Meyers Manx, a T-Bucket, a chopper.

But then again, maybe a vehicle that is generally modified by the owner should fit in here somewhere? At what point is it "built"?
What if the owner never really "built" it at all but bought a ton of expensive parts and paid a shop to install them? It was "built" by the shop, right? But then does that make hand assembled cars like exotic Italians "built not bought"?
Is it the changes to the car that make it "built"? If so, then a factory restoration was not "built".

Useless banter but fun to think about.... Thoughts?
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  #2  
Old 08-23-2021, 05:21 PM
oregonphil oregonphil is offline
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Join Date: Oct 17, 2020
Location: Klamath Falls, Oregon
Posts: 116
POW. That just made my head explode.

I think your conclusion is correct:
"But then again, maybe a vehicle that is generally modified by the owner (or their shop) should fit in here somewhere?"
Thou I would never put that sticker on my car just because it did not come from the factory that way. At least it did not say "hand built not bought".
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  #3  
Old 08-23-2021, 08:27 PM
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JPSwapMohn JPSwapMohn is offline
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I don't think there is a line that has to be crossed, but to my eye, Built would be significant modification done mostly by the owner.

Example: My YJ mutt is built. The only things still original to it are the frame (straightened twice), most of the body, and the bottom end of the engine. I put in wagoneer D44's w/ CrMo shafts and ARB lockers, spring-over suspension on 2.5" OME springs, Bilstein reservoir shocks. I built the transfer case from D300 parts, aftermarket parts, and a STaKs case. The transmission is built AX-15 (bought), we made the body armor and I put a CJ7 hood and grill on it by modifying the mounts, etc. The seats are PT Cruiser, the center console is an ammo can I cut and welded. I did buy the bumpers instead of making them. A buddy and I designed and welded up the rear axle truss and anti-wrap bar/mount. The rear shocks were inboarded at top to give more articulation. It has modified TJ larger exhaust and I rebuilt the top end with some minor head work that was within my skill level. It is bounced off rocks, trees, whatever. I break it and rebuild/improve what I break.

I consider my mutt to be built... but I wouldn't put that sticker on it. 8^)
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88Wag, LT1/4L60E/NP242, F150 fuel cell, discs, Aussie rear, LDS front, 4.10s
http://imgbox.com/g/rNuIasKYrS
95YJ, STaK 300, D44's, SOA, ARB's, 4.56s, Bilsteins, 35" KM2's
50 CJ3A
77 J-10, 360/T-18/D20, SOLD

Last edited by JPSwapMohn : 08-23-2021 at 08:33 PM.
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  #4  
Old 08-23-2021, 09:31 PM
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FleetFox FleetFox is offline
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Join Date: Apr 04, 2018
Location: Blue Ridge Mountains
Posts: 282
My honest opinion is if you put a sticker like that on it, you feel like you something to prove. Or you're a bottomless pit of need and want for attention. And there's just nothing anyone is going to say to you about your rig that's gonna fill that hole. I take my stuff to cruise ins only occasionally. I park it and walk around to see some of the really neat engineering and stuff other people have put into their projects. Just me.

Fleet Fox
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  #5  
Old 08-24-2021, 12:02 PM
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Brynjminjones Brynjminjones is offline
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Join Date: Jun 11, 2017
Location: Derby, England
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I've never liked the term "Built Not Bought", it always seems like gatekeeping to me and I've never understood why it matters.

Loads of people here in the UK have those stickers, yet have bought a brand new car and simply spent loads at the shop getting it modified.

My XJ on the other hand is completely stock, yet I've had it for the last 9 years and I guarantee I've put more work into it than lots of people with modded cars have!

I don't think there's really a way of defining how much work somebody has put into a car.
Some people do it all themselves, others work hard to afford to pay a shop!
I'm won't hold either against somebody!
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  #6  
Old 08-24-2021, 09:01 PM
SJTD SJTD is offline
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Location: Lompoc and Sunland, CA
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Does it have to be running to be considered "built"?
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  #7  
Old 08-25-2021, 07:06 AM
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backroadin' backroadin' is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Aug 11, 2004
Location: Vermont
Posts: 1,019
Quote:
Originally Posted by FleetFox
I walk around to see some of the really neat engineering and stuff other people have put into their projects. Just me.
Me too - this is what I think of when I hear that saying.
We all got different levels of skill, time, and space to do stuff - and what we each consider "building our rig" isn't going to be the same as the next guy. But I do think you gotta do a good percentage of the work or installment yourself to be considered "built."
BUT - if you put that sticker on your ride, you'd better have done more than just slap on LED's , stickers, and rims and tires for me to have respect for it! Like the old saying goes, "If it don't make ya dirty, it ain't yours."
(Lease rigs need not apply....... )
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  #8  
Old 08-25-2021, 10:07 PM
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JPSwapMohn JPSwapMohn is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: May 01, 2004
Location: CO.
Posts: 1,481
If you haven't bleed on it, is it really yours?
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One day I will wake up and realize that my jeep is complete...one day, I just know it.

88Wag, LT1/4L60E/NP242, F150 fuel cell, discs, Aussie rear, LDS front, 4.10s
http://imgbox.com/g/rNuIasKYrS
95YJ, STaK 300, D44's, SOA, ARB's, 4.56s, Bilsteins, 35" KM2's
50 CJ3A
77 J-10, 360/T-18/D20, SOLD
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  #9  
Old 08-26-2021, 08:12 AM
johnsonic johnsonic is offline
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Join Date: Mar 12, 2015
Location: Oregon
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We're in luck - looks like you can build a wagoneer at jeep.com.

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360
Comp 260H
Harland Sharp Roller Rockers
Wiseco -21cc Forged Pistons
Performer Intake
Holley SA 670
MSD 8523
Dakota Digital custom cluster
Serehill headlamp harness
NWMP aux tank

1987 GW deceased
...but the parts live on
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  #10  
Old 08-26-2021, 05:18 PM
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Tripwire Tripwire is offline
hey,does anyone here know how to.......
 
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Location: WA State
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Wink

When your rig ( especially baby jeeps ) looks like a rich kid got ahold of mommies credit card and a few aftermarket accessory magazines and looks ridiculous
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86 GrandWag. Howell fuel Injected 360. MSD Ignition + Dizzy. 727/229 swap BJ's 2" Lift and 31's

88 Wrangler 4.2, Howell TBI and MSD - Borla Headers w/ Cat-back + winch and 31's AND a M416 trailer (-:
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  #11  
Old 08-27-2021, 07:44 AM
MysticRob MysticRob is offline
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Join Date: Nov 26, 2019
Location: Boise, ID
Posts: 634
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsonic
We're in luck - looks like you can build a wagoneer at jeep.com.

LOL, that sure blurs the lines.
Thinking about it, my 88 must be both. Since I 'built' it myself I still 'bought' many of the parts with which to build it.
I suppose it's what the 'built not bought' wording implies.
Can I get rich off "Built in My Garage" decals?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SJTD
Does it have to be running to be considered "built"?

How about "Built-ish"?
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1988 Jeep Grand Wagoneer / Baltic Blue & Tan
2008 BMW 535xi Wagon / Deep Sea Blue & Tan

My build thread:
https://ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=189245
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https://ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=189877

Last edited by MysticRob : 08-27-2021 at 07:51 AM.
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  #12  
Old 08-27-2021, 01:36 PM
oregonphil oregonphil is offline
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How about "Built-ish"?

That I like, it would apply to 97% of our rigs.
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  #13  
Old 08-28-2021, 11:02 PM
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wagoneer84 wagoneer84 is offline
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Join Date: Aug 16, 2014
Location: Beaumont, CA
Posts: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPSwapMohn
I don't think there is a line that has to be crossed, but to my eye, Built would be significant modification done mostly by the owner.

Personally i would have to agree with this, I have had my wagoneer for 15 years and i am the only one who has worked on it. Including changing the gearing, installing lockers, to building my own cage and bumpers. We can't forget all the upgrades that are mentioned in these forums like the ammeter delete or adding relays for windows or lights to rewiring for a higher amp altinator.
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