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New member in PNW - 1985 J20 survivor

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  • #61
    Originally posted by DarkMonohue
    Not sure what you mean by that. Can you disenjargonate that for me?


    Me too. Thanks for sharing the pic.
    Sorry. After I hit the peaks down I pulled the inside panels off the doors. Then I used a little block of copper I call a "spoon" and held that against the outside of a hole as a kind of mold for the fresh metal I laid down with the welder from the inside to form against, keeping weld boogers from pouring out while I filled the hole in short zaps. Steel won't bond with the copper and the copper pulls heat out quick. Doing it this way I didn't have to do any grinding of the welds inside or out, just a quick buff with a flap sander.
    2012 Winner of the Prestigious Ouray Cast Iron Butt Award
    79 J-10 - The Money Badger!
    304/T18/D20/D44s
    What's been did:
    Holley 4160/Ede' S.P.2.P.
    MSD Streetfire based TFI
    Custom-hack gauge cluster
    Razor swap
    Fancy exhaust (Thrush Muffler)
    2 knob tape deck!
    3" homebuilt lift
    Half a hillbilly paint job

    Comment


    • #62
      OH!

      Makes perfect sense. Although I do use a MIG machine frequently, I don't call myself a welder and am not hep to all the jive you youngsters sling. Thanks for the translation.
      '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
      Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
      High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

      Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

      Comment


      • #63
        Time marches on. Yesterday I received the tailgate support bars that WHSII was kind enough to send my way, so the tailgate can now be lowered to horizontal rather than bouncing off the rear bumper. Progress.

        I also went to the DMV and they were kind enough to lighten my wallet by a couple of hundred dollars, so Juliet now has fresh license plates and all the joy and resonsibility that goes along with them. After installing the plates it seemed fitting to go for a little drive. As before, the exterior lights work, but dash lights do not, so I just set my speed by the traffic around me. Some observations:

        Either the idle circuit is clogged or the carburetor is grossly misadjusted, or possibly both. The truck refuses to idle for more than a couple of seconds. It runs very rough and wants to stall when it gets down near idle speed. This means you have to tickle the gas while approaching a stop with your left foot on the brake, which gets genuinely interesting. The poor old girl runs so rough at low speeds that keeping it alive while holding gently with the brakes results in a sort of cyclical go-stop-go-stop-go-stop hopping motion. Funny, but hardly relaxing. Fine. Carburetor rebuild kits are cheap enough.

        Speaking of brake, the left rear brake locked up rather suddenly while gently slowing with traffic. OK, so maybe it wants wheel cylinders. I have not seen any gear oil seeping out of the brake area, but would not be surprised to find brake shoes wet with oil contributing to some rather adventuresome braking behavior.

        The ride - if that word can be used with a straight face - is a little wiggly. I am used to a firm ride, but this seemed a little silly, like a huge red spring horse bobbing along through traffic. Shock absorbers appear to be installed at all four corners but may be cosmetic only. I'm sure the worn seat is responsible for a good portion of the uncontrolled motion. I will take a closer look at tire pressures etc. and see what's what.

        We got across town and pulled up in front of the house. The power wire to the license plate light had been severed, so that got a fresh length of wire spliced in. Of course, the bulb was burned out as well. To be expected.

        I was hoping to find a blown fuse responsible for the lack of instrument panel illumination. All the fuses looked good and tested good, but there was no power at all to the instrument panel fuse. Not sure yet whether this is a problem with the light switch (which feels like it was salvaged from the Titanic) or something else.

        Also tried installing the inside door handle on the driver's door, but sure enough, it will not open from the inside. That is frustrating at best. The door will open from the outside, but only when the lock pin is held up (either by hand or by turning the key in the lock). The latch and handle mechanism will get a good going-over, and both window regulators are a little stubborn, so they will be thoroughly cleaned and lubed as well.

        Back in the truck, scoot over to the nearest Bi-Mart for a #89 bulb and an industrial size bag of Don Pancho tortilla chips. Got the bulb installed in the parking lot. There was just enough contact between the bumper and the license plate lamp to generate intermittent illumination. Let's call it tentative, but optimistic.

        Gas-key-crankcrankWHOOMPF and we're running, such as it is, once again. Foot on brake, foot on gas, into gear, and there's just enough light from the parking lot's lamps to show that there is no oil pressure on the gauge. Not "low" oil pressure - NO oil pressure. The engine isn't making and hasn't made any unusual mechanical noises, so I am pretty confident this is an electrical issue and not a mechanical one. Press on.

        I have a package to trop at the UPS distribution center, a few miles away over 30-40 mph streets. Easy enough. There are a few opportunities to accelerate away from stoplights. The old girl actually runs relatively (very relatively) smoothly under power. Knowing that the rear brakes are touchy, I am careful to take it easy approaching intersections. Well before I need to, I brake gently for the DC and the truck dives hard to the right. OK! So that decision's made for me: we're getting new calipers up front and new wheel cylinders out back as soon as possible.

        Time to start drawing up a shopping list.

        Also better look for some electrical help. I have Oljeep's scans but they are a little fuzzy for me. Better run out in the shop and see if one of the techs can find anything on Alldata for me.
        '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
        Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
        High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

        Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

        Comment


        • #64
          Looks like a solid base to start with, as usual lots of futtzy things to fix/replace repair.
          -----------------------------------------
          Home of ADHD project list

          1977 J-10 Honcho 360-T15-D20
          1977 Cherokee WT 360-Th400-NP241 true-trac(s)
          1979 Cherokee 4 Door 258-T-18-D20
          1981 Cherokee Chief WT 360-727-NP208
          1972 K20 Suburban 350 SM465 205
          And the other stuff that gets driven
          ----------------------------------------

          Comment


          • #65
            Yessir, and I'm finding more futzy things every time I look. Unfortunately, I am very suddenly finding myself unemployed, which puts further developments on hold for the time being.

            To tell you the plain truth, I was tired of that job anyway...
            '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
            Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
            High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

            Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

            Comment


            • #66
              I have made a little progress.

              The hood release cable and lever combo was replaced. One of the POs had, for some reason, flipped the cable bracket on the front edge of the hood so the cable ran underneath the hood brace. I flipped it over, routed the cable between the brace and the sheetmetal, and it works a lot better.

              While I was in that area, the parking brake pedal came out for a few minutes. The pedal would not stay down because the pawl was sticking in the 'up' position and not engaging with the teeth. A little PB Blaster and gentle persuasion cured that...

              The brakes have been freshened up with some rebuilt front calipers, new rear wheel cylinders, new master cylinder, and new rubber hoses. The master and calipers were easy as pie, but accessing the wheel cylinder hardware was not fun. Getting the rear circuit bled was also a royal pain but for some reason (possibly coincidence) got easier after I gave up and bled the fronts.

              Now that I have brakes, the engine has decided to compensate by running worse and worse. It's flatly refusing to idle. The next step is a carb rebuild and replacement of the cap, rotor, plugs, and wires. Should be easy enough...in theory...though I may have to learn more than I wanted to about the goofy add-ons (solenoid, etc) on and around the carburetor.
              '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
              Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
              High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

              Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

              Comment


              • #67
                As I mentioned, I lost my job last month, so I've had time to play with the truck but no budget until we get unemployment sorted out and/or find a new job. I've been addressing some of the cheaper things and trying to repair rather than replace wherever possible.

                The ignition switch was a real fighter, so I replaced that with a new one, which works so much better. For some reason I had to chase the threads in the steering wheel with a tap to get the puller bolts to thread in.

                I went ahead and replaced the distributor cap and rotor. They weren't actually in horrible shape, and the plugs looked OK, but they were Autolites (not my favorite) and most of them were hardly more than finger-tight. The wires were awful. Resistance checked out fine on the few that I looked at but the insulation was dry as a bone and the spark plug boots were coming apart rather than coming off the plugs. I replaced a couple of plugs and wires while I had some daylight, but the goofy thing still refused to start easily or idle worth a darn. In fact it still sounded pretty miserable.

                Tried the old Sea Foam down the carburetor trick, let it sit for half an hour, but it refused to smoke at all. While poking around under the hood with the engine running I noticed a hissing sound coming from the left side of the engine bay. Some goober (not pointing fingers here) dislodged a vacuum line from the soup can on the driver's side inner fender. Nice one. Maybe the Sea Foam simply burned up rather than collecting in the combustion chambers...

                With that line plugged back in, things got a lot better. I replaced the rest of the plugs and wires, routed them fairly neatly for the time being (though I will probably redo them shortly), reset the ignition timing (it was retarded a couple of degrees), and started playing with the carburetor. Since it is running so much better now I am not going to rebuild it yet. For now I just poured a third of a can of Sea Foam into the fuel in hopes that it loosens up anything that doesn't belong in the carburetor.

                The next thing to get attention was the hood. One of the two latch posts on the core support was fine, and the other was stuck in the compressed position, so I removed it and opened up the hole in the spring cup enough that the cup could slide up the post as designed. Easy enough. The hood is a little easier to open now. Also lubed the hood hinges while I was thinking about it.

                The speedometer lens was laying loose and none of the instrument panel lights worked, so I pulled the gauge cluster to repair the lens and replace the bulbs. Removing the cluster was a bit of a struggle. Turns out the bulbs were fine, other than the four wheel drive indicator lamp, but I replaced them all anyway, polished the lenses, and reattached the speedo and oil pressure/ammeter lenses (the latter having fallen out during disassembly) with JB Kwik.

                The heater and ventilation controls were also lodged in the defrost position. The culprit there was the little vacuum selector, which had become stuck in one position, preventing the selector buttons from rotating it around to any other positions. I broke that loose by very lightly holding one side in a bench vise and tapping the other half. With those freed up I deburred and lubed the selector blades and once again had a smoothly working HVAC control panel.

                Today was a pretty good day. I got the instrument cluster back in, but the oil pressure gauge and fuel gauge were both maxing out as soon as the ignition was switched on. I went through the TSM and lost some time chasing what I thought was a bad ground to the instrument cluster. Turns out it was a bad ground within the instrument cluster. Thanks to 710 Burner for mentioning this in his ammeter conversion thread (link here): On the schematic, the housing of this [temperature] gauge is grounded. However it does not have a dedicated ground point. There are two tabs that should touch the housing, but due to age, warpage, etc, it is easy to break this contact. If the ground is lost, all of the gauges will go full on...

                I took the cluster back to the shop and pulled it all apart again, brightened up the backing plate with a wire brush, bent the contact tabs on the temperature gauge so that they made firm contact with the backing plate, and reassembled the cluster. I also soldered one of the pins for the oil pressure gauge to some ring terminals, basically replicating the trace on the circuit board, because the pin had become broken and detached itself from the circuit board.

                All is well now. I have a fully functional instrument panel again. No voltmeter conversion for now, though I may do that later on.

                Sorry for the lack of pics. I was lazy, and figured you guys have probably seen most of this before anyway. I can add some later if you like.
                Last edited by DarkMonohue; 02-23-2013, 09:47 PM.
                '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                Comment


                • #68
                  It's good to make progress
                  Brad
                  (*Allowed to post while failed 'I am not a Bot' test results are under appeal)

                  My build thread: 1982 Cherokee Laredo

                  Ristow's Bunker

                  Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Indeed. I totally forgot to mention that the cause of the instrument panel lights not working was a failed headlight switch. That got replaced while the cluster was out.

                    Sorry...I'm probably getting tired.
                    '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                    Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                    High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                    Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      No significant progress here, but I took a couple of pics just for fun. I still haven't bothered to properly clean the engine bay, or even wash the truck, but we'll get there. Anyway, the engine bay looks a little better with new plug wires and a bit of carburetor cleaner sprayed over the carb.




                      I fiddled with it yesterday and introduced some Sea Foam through one of the vacuum lines. That gave a tremendous smoke show right under the hood. Apparently the check valve on the air injection system is bad, and the hose that feeds it is completely rotten, so exhaust is coming right in to the engine bay through that check valve.

                      The Sea Foam was followed with about a quart of water also pulled in through a vacuum line, which produced an absolutely massive cloud of steam at the tailpipe. Unfortunately I managed to do that just as as group of high school kids were walking past on the sidewalk. I felt bad, but at least it was only steam they were walking through.

                      Here are a couple of pics of the gauge cluster after renovation. It was hard to get a decent shot in the fading daylight, and I couldn't find an angle that didn't show a bunch of reflections of the gauge lenses, but here you go.






                      Hard to believe I've put 120 miles on it already!
                      Last edited by DarkMonohue; 04-13-2020, 08:47 PM.
                      '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                      Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                      High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                      Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        That's beautiful DM, nice work on that gauge cluster! I tried to do that on my J-10, but it was too corroded on the electronic bits. A few weeks after I put it back in, pieces of small wirey things started falling on my feet.

                        Keep driving it, that's the best way to keep them alive!

                        Looking forward to the next 120 miles.
                        2012 Winner of the Prestigious Ouray Cast Iron Butt Award
                        79 J-10 - The Money Badger!
                        304/T18/D20/D44s
                        What's been did:
                        Holley 4160/Ede' S.P.2.P.
                        MSD Streetfire based TFI
                        Custom-hack gauge cluster
                        Razor swap
                        Fancy exhaust (Thrush Muffler)
                        2 knob tape deck!
                        3" homebuilt lift
                        Half a hillbilly paint job

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Thanks! It's getting better, bit by bit. Got some great stuff from BJ's today - new wiper knob, window cranks, an inside door handle, and some springs for the door lock linkage. Unfortunately this means I now have to find two new screws for the handle on the driver's door (my truck uses a coarser thread than the screws that come with the new handles) and make time to tear into the doors for a thorough linkage and window regulator de-gunk and lube job.

                          Oh, well. Time is something I have lately, and I haven't yet had to buy anything especially expensive.
                          '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                          Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                          High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                          Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Down in Roseburg here, have a few parts and pieces and a great deal of interest. Shoot me a PM, watching the thread to see where this goes.
                            1977 Cherokee Chief Levi's Edition: specs to follow investigation.

                            2002 TJ Wrangler "APEX" Edition 4.7 Stroker, 4" RC Lift, 33" Toyo MT's, SmittyBuilt Front Bumper. More to follow

                            1974 J-10 258, T18/D20, D44 F/R 4.10 gears and LSD (No... not that type of LSD)

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Great! I don't need a whole lot at the moment but another guy in Eugene is looking for a spare tire carrier:

                              http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=163961

                              You may be disappointed if you watch too closely. I move pretty slowly and never do anything really spectacular. My goal with this old monster is really just to get it running and driving well, and take out as much of the neglect and decay as possible, on a pretty tight budget.
                              '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                              Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                              High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                              Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                There has been only a little progress recently. Last month I wiped that graffiti off the rear bumper and removed three bumper stickers left by one of the previous owners. A small victory, but victory nonetheless.

                                I got the new door lock spring installed in the driver's door and cleaned/lubed the window regulator as well as I could, which helped a lot, but the new belt moulding on the outside of the door glass added a lot of new friction to the act of winding the window up and down. One step forward, two steps back, etc.

                                I also attempted to replace the air injection check valve on the passenger side, but the valve was absolutely not interested in coming off the injection rail. No problem, we can still replace the burned-out hose...which showed a very broken plastic tee when removed. Just lifting that tee to try installing the new (special ordered, non-returnable, $26 worth of silicone) hose, the check valve pulled the driver's side injection rail apart. It became apparent that this truck does not want an air injection system after all. So be it. We'll get some pics up when that work is finished.
                                '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                                Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                                High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                                Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                                Comment

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