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  #1  
Old 10-23-2019, 10:41 AM
Beach_Dude's Avatar
Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
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Remaking Factory Harness with OE colors and awg

I've got a few questions about the wire harness for my 77 Cherokee.

On the wiring diagrams, some of the engine bay wires have a name such as "21 BROWN 16 (8 & 6)". From what I gather, the 21 is the circuit number, the color is the wire color, and 16 is what? I assume it's the gauge.

However, many of the wires that are close the the engine are "8 & 6". Does this mean it's a thicker gauge to prevent over heating?

Also, before tearing apart the harness to firewall and fuse box, is there anything that makes it easier? For example, if I unscrew both the fuse panel and the firewall grommet, does it just separate?

Also, if I make this successfully, would anyone be interested in purchasing this? If so, how much?
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #2  
Old 10-23-2019, 11:27 AM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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Location: Medford MA USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beach_Dude
On the wiring diagrams, some of the engine bay wires have a name such as "21 BROWN 16 (8 & 6)". From what I gather, the 21 is the circuit number, the color is the wire color, and 16 is what? I assume it's the gauge.
Yes, gauge.

Quote:
However, many of the wires that are close the the engine are "8 & 6". Does this mean it's a thicker gauge to prevent over heating?
8 and 6 cylinder engines. Unlike the V8s, 6s have a Delco unitized alternator and maybe other differences, and both schemes are drawn on the same sheet.

Quote:
Also, before tearing apart the harness to firewall and fuse box, is there anything that makes it easier? For example, if I unscrew both the fuse panel and the firewall grommet, does it just separate?
I recall there are long screws that attach the bulkhead connector / fuse panel to the firewall. The big screw only separates the connector halves. The fuse panel and body side of the bulkhead connector are one piece.
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Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk

Last edited by tgreese : 10-23-2019 at 11:54 AM.
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  #3  
Old 10-23-2019, 12:17 PM
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Full Size Jeeper Full Size Jeeper is offline
304 AMC
 
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Location: Mandeville Louisiana
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Not to burst your bubble, but Z&M Jeeps does the engine harness for $250.00 They also have other harnesses for FSJ.
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1978 Wagoneer

401/turbo 400 trans. Quadra-Trac BW1339 (with Low) 4" Rusty's lift with 31" Summit Mud Dawgs

Mods:
Fuel Tank, Red Holley Fuel Pump, Razor Grill (profile pic out dated), Rebuilt steering box
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  #4  
Old 10-23-2019, 02:54 PM
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Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
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Well, crap...

Just called and left a message to ask'em a few questions. To voicemail.

Gonna order the wire by tomorrow, let's see if they get back to me... I've been noticing more and more that fsj shops really don't like to get back to ya...
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #5  
Old 10-23-2019, 03:17 PM
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itselliot itselliot is offline
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Join Date: Aug 28, 2010
Location: 49410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beach_Dude
Well, crap...

Just called and left a message to ask'em a few questions. To voicemail.

Gonna order the wire by tomorrow, let's see if they get back to me... I've been noticing more and more that fsj shops really don't like to get back to ya...

Be patient...he works part time at the business
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'78 J-20 401 Q/T not quite stock anymore....Frame off Resto Mod..Super Cab nearing completion. SOMEDAY
"90 GW 360/727/229/3:31s 2" lift (SOLD in 2015)
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  #6  
Old 10-23-2019, 06:51 PM
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Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
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That guy at z and m was super rad!

Does anyone have a reference, images, or videos on how the harness disconnects from the firewall?
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #7  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:32 PM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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Location: Medford MA USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beach_Dude
That guy at z and m was super rad!

Does anyone have a reference, images, or videos on how the harness disconnects from the firewall?

I don't understand. Did you read my reply above? Have you put your head under the hood and dash and looked? There's a screw in the middle of the connector on the engine side. remove that and the engine side of the connector unplugs from the connector/fusebox. Look under the dash and there are long (socket head?) screws that hold the fuse box to the firewall. I believe you can see them sticking through on the engine side. Remove those and the connector/fusebox is loose from the firewall, and only held in by the wires. It's all one assembly.

If I remember accurately. I am sure it's not complicated though.
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Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk
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  #8  
Old 10-24-2019, 04:44 PM
SJTD SJTD is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Apr 26, 2012
Location: Lompoc and Sunland, CA
Posts: 1,384
You remember correctly except the engine side is actually two connectors but they are both held by the center screw.
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'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.
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  #9  
Old 10-29-2019, 03:01 PM
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Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
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Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
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I'm just gonna redo the bad wire that needs to be done but also tweak a few things...

I can't seem to find the terminal connectors that slip over the threaded studs for the alternator, coolant temp, etc...

What are those female connectors with an angle called?
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #10  
Old 10-29-2019, 04:01 PM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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Location: Medford MA USA
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Not sure what they are called, but I found several sources: https://www.wiringdepot.com/store/p/...ail-2-Pcs.aspx

Another: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Right-...-/272099180726

Try this search - https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=automotive+wiring+pigtail+stud+connectors

Alternator should have a nut and ring connector, not push-on.
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Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk
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  #11  
Old 10-30-2019, 09:15 AM
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Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
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Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 559
AWESOME! Thank you!

I get the 'fusible link' now! I redid the harness like 15-years ago because of this similar issue. It ends up being that I should have put a fusible link of 14AWG on the charge line.

OMG... It makes sense now!
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #12  
Old 01-01-2020, 06:08 PM
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Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
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Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
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Decided to make a project out of this harness... It would have only cost a few hundred more to have the ZM setup, but as it is now, original fuse block, all color-coordinated wires, upgraded the entire harness to the MSD with Duraspark and TFI, plus top-quality heat and cut resistant conduit.

The only items left are either being able to remove the male connectors from the rear of the block or solder these in place... Dear god I hope I can pull the plugs out of the block...



TFI connector, everything is not just crimped, but flux used and touched with a 200w solder gun.



Alternator run + Oil Pressure



Here's the Fusible-link that my lack off caused this entire project. Also, the extra 12awg wire for my subwoofer under the passenger side seat, which I haven't finished the connectors for.



And finally, the regulator and connector to the MSD ignition module. Ridiculous, I know... Waterproof. :P




Anyone tried pulling the male pins from the engine bay side of the fuse block?
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #13  
Old 01-01-2020, 06:08 PM
Beach_Dude's Avatar
Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
327 Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 559
Decided to make a project out of this harness... It would have only cost a few hundred more to have the ZM setup, but as it is now, original fuse block, all color-coordinated wires, upgraded the entire harness to the MSD with Duraspark and TFI, plus top-quality heat and cut resistant conduit.

The only items left are either being able to remove the male connectors from the rear of the block or solder these in place... Dear god I hope I can pull the plugs out of the block...



TFI connector, everything is not just crimped, but flux used and touched with a 200w solder gun.



Alternator run + Oil Pressure



Here's the Fusible-link that my lack off caused this entire project. Also, the extra 12awg wire for my subwoofer under the passenger side seat, which I haven't finished the connectors for.



And finally, the regulator and connector to the MSD ignition module. Ridiculous, I know... Waterproof. :P




Anyone tried pulling the male pins from the engine bay side of the fuse block?
__________________
1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years

Last edited by Beach_Dude : 01-01-2020 at 06:14 PM.
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  #14  
Old 01-01-2020, 07:03 PM
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SOLSAKS SOLSAKS is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Jul 25, 2016
Location: Benson. NC
Posts: 969
that is a fine job on the harness
that black mesh covering
looks really nice.

dave in NC
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1976 J-10 HONCHO Fleetside
1982 J-10 Fleetside
1988 grand wagoneer
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  #15  
Old 01-01-2020, 07:36 PM
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lkmarsh lkmarsh is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 1,206
Harness looks great, especially with the woven sleeves.


The male terminals should be Packard 56 series, meaning they unlock
by using a tiny screwdriver or something similar to compress one edge.
This happens from the blade side, not the wire side. In this case, from
the dash side, not the engine bay. Search "Packard 56 connectors" to
see how they work. The larger blades are made the same, Packard 59(?)
Small tool kits are available to make your job easier.

I would not go to the trouble to rewire a glass fuse block. AGC fuses were
always a pain, worse if the sockets rusted up.
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Lyle

Seemed like a good idea at the time...
69 1414x Wagoneer 350/TH400 DD & Ski Ride
68 Chevelle wagon 350/BWT50
68 Impala wagon 327/400
73 Cougar droptop 351C/FMX Garage Queen
04 Impala LS - Wife's DD
73 Wagoneer parts donor

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  #16  
Old 01-01-2020, 09:38 PM
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Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
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The bulkhead connector is a MESS!!! Got everything separated, took noted, photos, to redo it, but I can't seem to clean the thing up!

Does anyone know a part number for the GM bulkhead connector? Is it still available or orderable?

This is after a good 45 minutes of scrubbing. I think those AMC bastards used tar as an insulator.






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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
All stock but ignition and slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #17  
Old 01-01-2020, 09:50 PM
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babywag babywag is offline
out of order
 
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Location: Land of froot loops and cukcoo-nuts, CA
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carb spray works, that crap is awful stuff.
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  #18  
Old 01-01-2020, 10:33 PM
SJTD SJTD is offline
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Join Date: Apr 26, 2012
Location: Lompoc and Sunland, CA
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I think the goo was for waterproofing. Haven't started on the engine side of mine yet. Not looking forward to it.

I wonder if the terminals are available. If so I could just cut all the wires and throw the rest in a bucket of solvent until I have to work on it.
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'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.
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  #19  
Old 01-02-2020, 12:24 PM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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Location: Medford MA USA
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Yeah, the brownish goo is dielectric grease, assumedly to block out water and corrosion. Fugly but not a problem. Get some spray cans of contact cleaner, a brush and a lot of rags to clean it. WD-40 might also work well. Whatever you use needs to cut the grease and not harm the plastic - I would not risk using a hot solvent like carb cleaner. You can leave it alone if it does not offend your aesthetic sense too much. Goop it up afterwards with aftermarket dielectric grease, available in a tube. https://www.amazon.com/Permatex-22058-Dielectric-Tune-Up-Grease/dp/B000AL8VD2

These are regular Packard connectors, except for a few larger ones which are just larger versions of the same connector. They should be available somewhere... I can look more later. In the past I've drilled out melted connections and run a wire non-stop through the bulkhead - no one will know but you and me.
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Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk
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  #20  
Old 01-03-2020, 10:53 PM
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lkmarsh lkmarsh is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 1,206
https://www.customconnectorkits.com/
buyWiring.com
https://www.repairconnector.com/


Try these for starters, I'm sure there are plenty of other sources.
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Lyle

Seemed like a good idea at the time...
69 1414x Wagoneer 350/TH400 DD & Ski Ride
68 Chevelle wagon 350/BWT50
68 Impala wagon 327/400
73 Cougar droptop 351C/FMX Garage Queen
04 Impala LS - Wife's DD
73 Wagoneer parts donor

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