International Full Size Jeep Association
Home Forums Reader's Rigs Tech Library Trail Stories FSJ-List
International Full Size Jeep Association  

Go Back   International Full Size Jeep Association > Tire Kickin' > General FSJ Tech

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-24-2008, 12:55 PM
Mex in the city's Avatar
Mex in the city Mex in the city is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 25, 2008
Location: Hendersonville, NC
Posts: 182
Engine noise, 4.0 swap????

OK, first of all, I’ve searched and couldn’t find exactly what I need to know. Now for the main story, I finally had the gear ratio changed and lockers installed in my 83 Waggy. The shop owner (a close friend) and myself took it out for a test drive in some moderate difficulty hills close to his shop and it performed better than I expected (sorry, no pics). We spent about one hour wheeling and no issues other than the tires rubbing a bit in the fender flares. This was expected and I already had planed to do some trimming. No strange engine noises, no overheating, good oil pressure, decent engine power.

Then I dropped my friend at his shop, loaded some spare parts and tools in the Waggy and started the 170 Km trip back home with another friend driving his truck behind me just in case something goes wrong. After about 15 Km I was doing about 100 Km/h when I started hearing a light knocking noise. Then it became louder so I pulled over. I shifted the transmission to Park and the noise became a bit louder. Shifted back to Drive and it became a little less louder, but it was still there. Shifted back to park and got out of the Waggy and crawled under it. The noise didn’t seem to come from the tranny, but from the engine. However, it was getting dark and the noise became VERY loud so I decided to turn off the waggy and didn’t spend enough time looking for the origin of the noise.

My friend towed me back to the town where I keep my cars (not enough room at home) and we drove back home talking about what the problem could be. Here are my options:
  • Engine damage: rods, bearings, valves.
  • Transmission problem: I installed the torque converter recently, and a bolt could be loose. I personally don’t think this is very likely, but the possibility is there.
I will check the tranny this coming weekend. If everything is OK, I will have to take the waggy back to my friend’s shop for a diagnostic. If it ends up being related to the engine internals and there’s a need for a rebuild, I think it would be a better idea to do an engine swap, since the AMC 360 engine and parts are not very common in this part of the world, and 4.0 engines are VERY common.

So, here are my questions:
  • Does anyone have an idea of what the cause of the noise could be??? Coolant level was OK, temperature gauge needle was right in the middle and oil level and pressure were OK too. Apart from the noise, the engine felt as strong as usual.
  • If I have to get a 4.0 from a scrap yard, what should be included with the engine??? Flex plate? Starter? Fuel pump? ECU? Harness? Sensosrs? Is there a write up about this swap???? I know my way around cars and I’ve done a few engine swaps and EFI conversions, so this kind of project does not scare me at all.
  • Can anybody that has done this swap tell me what his / her impressions are??? Is it worth it??? Is it better or worse powerwise???
Thanks everyone in advance.
__________________
83 Wagoneer. Front: 35 spline D60, Coil spring conversion, E-Locker. Rear: Sterling 10.5, Shackle flip, Detroit. Gear ratio 5.38:1. 39.5 Interco Irok's, HEI, hydroboost, hydroassist, bob job, sliders, roll cage, 12K winch. Runs on propane!!!
87 GW, 3", 4.10, 32" BFG AT, K8600, 2131, 1406, HEI, hydroboost.
71 Datsun 240Z turbo.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-24-2008, 01:04 PM
YellowJeep's Avatar
YellowJeep YellowJeep is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Jan 20, 2007
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 822
You are right with your guesses of torque convertor or engine. Did the noise increase in speed when you revved the engine? In all likely hood, if it's not a loose convertor bolt, you probably spun a bearing or a rod is getting ready to let loose.

Can't help you with the swap info, but the 4.0 is a great motor and I highly recommend it. Very reliable and decent power and mileage.
__________________
Chad-
88 Wrangler - TBI350 SM465 Ford 8.8
79 Cherokee Golden Eagle - AKA "The Screamin Eagle" 5.3 Runs and Drives. TH400 and Q-Trac!
77 Pontiac CanAm - 6.0LSx/4l80e swap
2010 - Ford Flex Limited AKA the wifes wagon
Carbs suck!
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-24-2008, 01:27 PM
Mex in the city's Avatar
Mex in the city Mex in the city is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 25, 2008
Location: Hendersonville, NC
Posts: 182
Thanks foy your quick reply. Yes, the noise increased in speed when I revved the engine. I first tought it was related to the newly installed lockers or gears, but the noise continued even after a complete stop. So it has to come from the engine / tranny.

Thanks again, Enrique.
__________________
83 Wagoneer. Front: 35 spline D60, Coil spring conversion, E-Locker. Rear: Sterling 10.5, Shackle flip, Detroit. Gear ratio 5.38:1. 39.5 Interco Irok's, HEI, hydroboost, hydroassist, bob job, sliders, roll cage, 12K winch. Runs on propane!!!
87 GW, 3", 4.10, 32" BFG AT, K8600, 2131, 1406, HEI, hydroboost.
71 Datsun 240Z turbo.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-24-2008, 01:37 PM
Chevelleguy's Avatar
Chevelleguy Chevelleguy is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 20, 2003
Location: Hughes Springs, TX
Posts: 5,565
The swap has been done, but I can't remember who did it. The 4.2 was offered in the J trucks and Wags so the 4.0 should pull you around just fine.

If I were going to do it, I would get a complete XJ to work with until the swap was complete, then scrap the rest of it when you are sure your done.

Maybe you will get lucky and it will just be loose converter bolts, also look for a cracked flexplate.
__________________
David "If all else fails, read the instructions."
83 Wag Lt,BJ's 6"lift,360/727/Pinned229,D44/trac-lok,AMC20/lock-right,35/12.50 Baja MTZ,Pro-Jection EFI.
10$ NP229 fix http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=2520

Last edited by Chevelleguy : 11-24-2008 at 01:40 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-24-2008, 02:31 PM
Mex in the city's Avatar
Mex in the city Mex in the city is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 25, 2008
Location: Hendersonville, NC
Posts: 182
Cracked flex plate!!!! That's a good one. I'll check that too. Thanks.
__________________
83 Wagoneer. Front: 35 spline D60, Coil spring conversion, E-Locker. Rear: Sterling 10.5, Shackle flip, Detroit. Gear ratio 5.38:1. 39.5 Interco Irok's, HEI, hydroboost, hydroassist, bob job, sliders, roll cage, 12K winch. Runs on propane!!!
87 GW, 3", 4.10, 32" BFG AT, K8600, 2131, 1406, HEI, hydroboost.
71 Datsun 240Z turbo.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-24-2008, 04:00 PM
tgreese's Avatar
tgreese tgreese is offline
 
Join Date: May 29, 2003
Location: Medford MA USA
Posts: 11,159
The 4.0L can be easily installed in place of the inline 6s like the 258 and 282. However, changing a V8 for an I6 in a Wagoneer, or the reverse, is much more trouble. The motor mount towers are different. The radiator core support is different.

The inline 6 (258 or 4.0L) is longer than the V8, and in cars with an automatic, this moves the transmission toward the back. You will need to move the transmission crossmember toward the rear of the car and change the length of the drive shafts. You may also have trouble with interference between the transfer case and the fuel tank.

I assume you have an automatic transmission in your Wagoneer? The manual transmission Wagoneers do not move the transmission; instead they use a long input shaft and a spacer to add extra distance between the V8 engine and transmission.

hth!
__________________
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:25 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
corner corner