International Full Size Jeep Association
Home Forums Reader's Rigs Tech Library Trail Stories FSJ-List
International Full Size Jeep Association  

Go Back   International Full Size Jeep Association > Tech Archives > Suspension and Steering

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #41  
Old 05-11-2007, 07:10 PM
Kimbrough's Avatar
Kimbrough Kimbrough is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: May 14, 2000
Location: Chattanooga,TN USA
Posts: 1,541
Anybody attaching the draglink to the passenger-side steering arm next to the tie-rod? Anything wrong with that setup?
__________________
1991 Hunter Green Grand Wagoneer. Chevy 350 TBI. 4-inch lift. 31-inch BFG AT's.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 05-13-2007, 08:14 PM
malodin's Avatar
malodin malodin is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Sep 03, 2004
Location: sumner washinton
Posts: 1,528
dont know yet, i think the only major thing would be length might be a little short(suppose it mainly depends upon your lift vs highsteer arms
__________________
1977 CHEROKEE CHIEF, 401, SOA FRONT SITTING ON HD44 4.10'S, TH400/D300 COMBO, 14BFF REAR WITH TT'S FAB'S REAR SHAKLE FLIP KIT, RB'S BRONCO TANK MOD. 35'S
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 05-14-2007, 09:05 AM
salamander's Avatar
salamander salamander is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 13, 2007
Location: siletz or
Posts: 17
ok i relise that a highster system would be best. However on scouts and samuris in the old days we used Z link. Wich dose have down sides bump stere you half to build it. I have run this it dose work for a while and alow you to use your rig while you save up for high stere. Just a thought.



yes this is old school
yes it was the only way back in the day
yes there are better ways now
but it works

PS my POS will have one to get it going till i collect all my high stere parts





__________________
1986 J10 258 4SPD 35S NEEDING MORE GOODIES
1989 toy x-cab lockers 37 mtr 5.29s cam
1990 toy 4.3 v6 38 boggers sand toy
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 05-14-2007, 09:17 AM
Tad's Avatar
Tad Tad is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 30, 2001
Location: Out West
Posts: 17,617
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimbrough
Anybody attaching the draglink to the passenger-side steering arm next to the tie-rod? Anything wrong with that setup?

Not me personally but there are a few pic's like that in the BillaVista steering research pages over on Pirate.
As long as nothing binds and turning effort/radius remain about the same i'm thinking it's not a big deal.
__________________
2000 Infinity QX4, 3.3L, MPFI, 4 speed auto, 2 speed Nissan tcase, Unibody, IFS front, 4 link rear solid axle with 255-70/16s

IFSJA WMS PROJECT
EARLY WAG LIFT SEARCH

Quote:
...Pay no attention to these heathen barbarians with their cutting torches and 8" lift kits!...

Self Inflicted Flesh Wound
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 05-14-2007, 05:02 PM
Doug3651 Doug3651 is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 26, 2007
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20
I've been doing a lot of research on the SOA lift and I think I have all the items covered, but then I came across this exerpt from the CFSJA.org lift kit artical.


Then, to correct caster, which enables you to steer properly and causes the
wheels to recenter after turns,
the steering knuckles must be cut off and
re-welded at the proper angle.
This isn't something for a shadetree mechanic
to try. Only a very skilled individual who won't weaken the axles and will
set up the driveline angle properly can pull this off. I'd expect to pay at
least $1000 for this job. You might also need to look at high clearance
steering kits to avoid hanging up your tie rods on every rock. This isn't a
DIY as a mistake can, of course, be deadly. You'll need a mechanical engineer
for the design and a machinist for the implementation to do this right.
That's why it'd be better to buy a kit. There, you've been warned
.

This is the first I have heard of this?? Can I get a bit of input on this from you SOA guru's?

Thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 05-14-2007, 08:36 PM
Tad's Avatar
Tad Tad is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 30, 2001
Location: Out West
Posts: 17,617
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug3651
...Can I get a bit of input on this from you SOA guru's?

Thanks!
Yes, you can.
It's wrong as far as it applies to our FSJ's as long as you mount the SOA perches in the same orientation to the original perches.

I'm not tooting my stuff here, but unless you rotate the pinion up, you did not change anything. Nothing, Nada, No Place, No How.

With all due respect, I have asked several times to have that portion of the CFSJA writeup edited for accuracy, that portion is just BS.
I doubt the author has ever performed an SOA himself or drives a SOA FSJ rig.

I drive one (a SOA FSJ rig) almost daily, I drive one on the interstate at 65-75 mph, some times for 200 miles at a shot.

(yes, I know who the author is, he's a mod here and a good friend of friends of mine, but I still think it's a bunch of second hand compiled bull ****).
__________________
2000 Infinity QX4, 3.3L, MPFI, 4 speed auto, 2 speed Nissan tcase, Unibody, IFS front, 4 link rear solid axle with 255-70/16s

IFSJA WMS PROJECT
EARLY WAG LIFT SEARCH

Quote:
...Pay no attention to these heathen barbarians with their cutting torches and 8" lift kits!...

Self Inflicted Flesh Wound
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 05-15-2007, 05:50 AM
Kimbrough's Avatar
Kimbrough Kimbrough is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: May 14, 2000
Location: Chattanooga,TN USA
Posts: 1,541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug3651
This is the first I have heard of this?? Can I get a bit of input on this from you SOA guru's?

Thanks!
They don't call it the Off-Road FSJ Tech forum for nothing.
__________________
1991 Hunter Green Grand Wagoneer. Chevy 350 TBI. 4-inch lift. 31-inch BFG AT's.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 05-15-2007, 08:43 AM
Doug3651 Doug3651 is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 26, 2007
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20
Thanks Tad!

I was gettin a bit worried about doin my SOA. You have revitalized my motivation!!!
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 05-17-2007, 04:09 PM
Kimbrough's Avatar
Kimbrough Kimbrough is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: May 14, 2000
Location: Chattanooga,TN USA
Posts: 1,541
drag link in front of tie rod???

I have a stupid question: Is the drag link supposed to mounted in front of the tie rod? If I try to mount on the rear hole, it crosses the tie rod. Sooo; DRAG LINK connects to forward hole on pass-side - TIE ROD connects to the rearward hole on pass-side. TIE ROD connects to where on driver's-side? Forward or rear hole???
__________________
1991 Hunter Green Grand Wagoneer. Chevy 350 TBI. 4-inch lift. 31-inch BFG AT's.

Last edited by Kimbrough : 05-17-2007 at 04:21 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 05-17-2007, 04:24 PM
j20brett's Avatar
j20brett j20brett is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 05, 2006
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 2,962
tierod connects to rear hole, draglink to front.

Edit: there should be only one hole on drivers side. But if you do have 2, then the rear hole.
__________________
"Kaiser" - 1981 J20 113" WB - 360 w/ hei/727/208-spooled hp60/detroit 14blt w/5.13's - 42's/CS144/Taurus fan/flatbed and roll bar
Future mods - 6.0l chevy

Build Thread

Fight Crime...Shoot Back.


Texas FSJA!

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 05-30-2007, 10:22 AM
Jeep4myBoys's Avatar
Jeep4myBoys Jeep4myBoys is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Jul 23, 2006
Location: Northern New Mexico
Posts: 942
Alrighty - this thread is very good - really makes me more confident in being able to do this myself. I was thinking BJs 6" for the ease of installation, but I believe the extra flex from the SOA would be better.

Doesn't look like there's one complete write-up, but all of the information is here. Since I don't have time to pick everything up piece by piece or fabricate parts myself (I just went from working solo to taking over a company with 12 employees ) I would prefer buying in kits.

So, of course I'm thinking Tads SOA kit and learning to weld (I'll practice lots first, but any concern with a noob welding on an axle?)

For the high steer, I was thinking this kit from Parts Mike. Would that work in our application? I would probably use the super arm kit.

Parts Mike also has a TRE kit, would the tie rod still need to be shortened though?

I know this ends up being more expensive, but right now I just don't have the time to do more myself, and I would rather spend the time I have working on the jeep.

Also - since this would end up being much more expensive than the 6" lift, is the extra flex really worth it?

Thanks guys, this thread is very informative!
__________________
Timothy
-------
It's for my twin boys Sure, they're only 1 year old, but it's all for them!

Daily Driver: 04 F350 6.0 CC LB FX4 Lariat

Jeep: 88 GW 360/727/229, Rusty's 4", 33" tires, Holley TA, TFI **Razor**

Last edited by Jeep4myBoys : 05-30-2007 at 10:41 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 05-30-2007, 10:35 AM
j20brett's Avatar
j20brett j20brett is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 05, 2006
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 2,962
I was considering using the same kit form partsmike at first, but i just couldnt see putting that much money since i would be eventually swapping in a d60.

All you need is the pass. side flat top knuckle and one super arm. So this saves you ~$500. Its not highsteer but you dont have to have highsteer. But the tierod end kit would be nice to have.
__________________
"Kaiser" - 1981 J20 113" WB - 360 w/ hei/727/208-spooled hp60/detroit 14blt w/5.13's - 42's/CS144/Taurus fan/flatbed and roll bar
Future mods - 6.0l chevy

Build Thread

Fight Crime...Shoot Back.


Texas FSJA!

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 05-30-2007, 11:12 AM
Tad's Avatar
Tad Tad is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 30, 2001
Location: Out West
Posts: 17,617
Timothy,
If you do x-over you will keep your tie rod (you could have a new one made but if yours is in good shape it's not really necessary) intact/same location and just need a slightly longer drag link to connect to the passenger side high-steer arm (get one of the many taller/super arms or get one with the spacer) on a flat top knuckle that has been milled/tapped/with the proper studs/cone washers and nuts, along with a 4" drop pitman arm.
I'm pretty sure both Parts Mike, Bull Gear and more than 1/2 those vendors listed on the first page will fab one up speedy like or sell you the whole package.
__________________
2000 Infinity QX4, 3.3L, MPFI, 4 speed auto, 2 speed Nissan tcase, Unibody, IFS front, 4 link rear solid axle with 255-70/16s

IFSJA WMS PROJECT
EARLY WAG LIFT SEARCH

Quote:
...Pay no attention to these heathen barbarians with their cutting torches and 8" lift kits!...

Self Inflicted Flesh Wound
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 05-31-2007, 07:25 AM
Jeep4myBoys's Avatar
Jeep4myBoys Jeep4myBoys is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Jul 23, 2006
Location: Northern New Mexico
Posts: 942
I've looked, but I don't see a good overview of the crossover steering. From what I'm gathering, you basically use a driver's high steer with the drag link under the springs? I'm not sure I get it, and I haven't seen one in person.

Anyone have a good,summary of what the crossover steering setup is?
__________________
Timothy
-------
It's for my twin boys Sure, they're only 1 year old, but it's all for them!

Daily Driver: 04 F350 6.0 CC LB FX4 Lariat

Jeep: 88 GW 360/727/229, Rusty's 4", 33" tires, Holley TA, TFI **Razor**
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 05-31-2007, 07:47 AM
j20brett's Avatar
j20brett j20brett is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 05, 2006
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 2,962
You dont need the drivers side if you are just doing crossover steering. Only the passenger side flat top knuckle.

here is a pic...top is stock steering. bottom is crossover

Edit here is a better pic and a page with a good writeup.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billav...ngresearch.htm
__________________
"Kaiser" - 1981 J20 113" WB - 360 w/ hei/727/208-spooled hp60/detroit 14blt w/5.13's - 42's/CS144/Taurus fan/flatbed and roll bar
Future mods - 6.0l chevy

Build Thread

Fight Crime...Shoot Back.


Texas FSJA!

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Last edited by j20brett : 05-31-2007 at 07:50 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 05-31-2007, 07:53 AM
Jeep4myBoys's Avatar
Jeep4myBoys Jeep4myBoys is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Jul 23, 2006
Location: Northern New Mexico
Posts: 942
Thanks, that makes sense.
__________________
Timothy
-------
It's for my twin boys Sure, they're only 1 year old, but it's all for them!

Daily Driver: 04 F350 6.0 CC LB FX4 Lariat

Jeep: 88 GW 360/727/229, Rusty's 4", 33" tires, Holley TA, TFI **Razor**
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 05-31-2007, 08:02 AM
Tad's Avatar
Tad Tad is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 30, 2001
Location: Out West
Posts: 17,617


I have a better pic of the completed assembly someplace.
__________________
2000 Infinity QX4, 3.3L, MPFI, 4 speed auto, 2 speed Nissan tcase, Unibody, IFS front, 4 link rear solid axle with 255-70/16s

IFSJA WMS PROJECT
EARLY WAG LIFT SEARCH

Quote:
...Pay no attention to these heathen barbarians with their cutting torches and 8" lift kits!...

Self Inflicted Flesh Wound
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 05-31-2007, 06:18 PM
malodin's Avatar
malodin malodin is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Sep 03, 2004
Location: sumner washinton
Posts: 1,528
Quote:
Originally Posted by tadsal


I have a better pic of the completed assembly someplace.

does your spacer on that picture have a taper to it?
__________________
1977 CHEROKEE CHIEF, 401, SOA FRONT SITTING ON HD44 4.10'S, TH400/D300 COMBO, 14BFF REAR WITH TT'S FAB'S REAR SHAKLE FLIP KIT, RB'S BRONCO TANK MOD. 35'S
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 05-31-2007, 08:34 PM
Tad's Avatar
Tad Tad is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 30, 2001
Location: Out West
Posts: 17,617
Quote:
Originally Posted by malodin
does your spacer on that picture have a taper to it?
It does have a taper, but that is not my spacer, arm or knuckle.
That's from a SOA welding road trip up to PHX I did back in March for a member here, SteelPonyCowboy.
IIRC he got the knuckle, spacer and arm from Kozz.

Here's a better pic of cross-over steering from JoshD in PHX.


Here's full high-steering.
__________________
2000 Infinity QX4, 3.3L, MPFI, 4 speed auto, 2 speed Nissan tcase, Unibody, IFS front, 4 link rear solid axle with 255-70/16s

IFSJA WMS PROJECT
EARLY WAG LIFT SEARCH

Quote:
...Pay no attention to these heathen barbarians with their cutting torches and 8" lift kits!...

Self Inflicted Flesh Wound
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 05-31-2007, 09:17 PM
malodin's Avatar
malodin malodin is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Sep 03, 2004
Location: sumner washinton
Posts: 1,528
cool, i get the material this weekend to cut my own arms now, i am using 2 3/4 wide by a minimum of 1 3/4 thick by 9 1/2" long piece for one arm(then there is no need for spacers) similar to http://www.ottindustries.com/Steering_arms_dana44.html
these ones he he he
__________________
1977 CHEROKEE CHIEF, 401, SOA FRONT SITTING ON HD44 4.10'S, TH400/D300 COMBO, 14BFF REAR WITH TT'S FAB'S REAR SHAKLE FLIP KIT, RB'S BRONCO TANK MOD. 35'S
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
corner corner