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  #1  
Old 07-21-2003, 01:23 PM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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First, I don't know exactally how or what type of U-bolts to use. I would like to use regular round ones, and a plate on top, but was told I would have to grind away some of the housing, because Ford used square ones, with a plate on the bottom. Any ideas here?
Secondly, I was told that using offset pads and flipping my springs end to end, would create to much of a caster problem. Could'nt I just degree shim that dued back close to normal? And what is the best position to have the pinion in? I was thinking that the flat surface on the top of the kingpin shold problably be level? If I have it level, would I be correct?
Third, I was also told that moving the axle forward without moving the steering gear forward would mess up my steering. But isn't that why Poison Spyder arms have several sets of holes, so you can move the drag link to a position that best makes the drag link parrallel with the axle tube?
I know several of you have done this swap, and by now have all the kinks out. Anyinput will help me get this done, so I can get the engine in and start cutting the frame! Thanks, Dennis
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Old 07-21-2003, 02:06 PM
River Beast River Beast is offline
 
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Dennis,

I have a GM D60 and the round U-bolts came with my axle in GREAT shape.... I can't help you out with the square ones...

I also did the direct bolt-in... which means I have not messed with caster setings at all.... once I am on the road... I will take my FSJ in to the Auto Hobby Shop on base and do an alignment using the specs for the 84 K30 the axles came from to get the correction numbers exact.

the only problem I see with moving the axle forward.. other than the caster being affected by the spring flip is the draglink interference as you mentioned... but the poison sider arms should correct that IF there is enuf room to do the necessary clearance needed.
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Old 07-22-2003, 07:40 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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btt
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Old 07-22-2003, 08:03 AM
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Aight hoss here we go...I got my u-bolts custom made out of 9/16 cold rolled steel at a spring shop here in town. They ran $12 bux a pair. I had them made all with the round bottom and then I just used some junkyard spring plates that I hacked up a bit with a torch to make them fit and clearance everything. All the u-bolts should be the same with the exception of the drivers side u-bolt closest to the pumpkin and it should have a bit bigger radius than the others in order to clear the cast. Other than that slap the spring plates on top and bolt em up. If I was you I would flip the springs, lower the truck down and just eyeball the pinion angle. If it looks like crap, forget about it and order a set of the spring relocation pads from www.mountainoffroad.com for 15 bux and just move the front axle forward 1in. The steering will definitely not be a problem moving the axle forward 1in and it still shouldn't be a prob going 2in but if it is that PSC arms will fix that. Just cycle the suspension from full droop to full stuff and if there is contact between the tie rod and drag link move them accordingly using the predrilled holes. One more thing, your frontend should have a factory spring perch that is cast into the pumpkin that basically will set your pinion angle for you. Just take an angle finder measure that angle and then tack weld your other perch on at the same angle. Bolt everything up loosely and eyeball it. If it looks good burn the welds in and you're done. You can also try flipping the springs like I said and eyeball it that way too. Hope this helps.
-Andrew
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Originally Posted by welchct
There are about 5 trails that actualy have section that are upwards of 85* and climb 40-50 feet at this deg.

"The combination of fine split tail and fine whiskey will make any man lose focus." -FSJeeper
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Old 07-22-2003, 09:24 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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Andrew, already have the offset pads. It appears that the spring flip is what is really gonna change the angle. How do you feel about using degree shims? I see they have 3 all the way to 12 degrees. I ordered the double and single arm from PSC today. Having the tie rod and ram assist behind the axle is gonna be a awsome mod. If flipping the springs looks like it's gonna screw to much up, I can always put them back normal. Thnaks, Dennis
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Old 07-22-2003, 03:02 PM
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are we using a big arch lift spring? im alittle confused about how flippig a flat spring is going to create a caster prollem,unless youre doing a shackle reversal at the same time.

if onroad time is going to be minimal,i wouldnt concern myself too much with the caster being zero,or just a couple degress of it. crawling over objects in low range its not going to matter. it may even help some in the steering dept. to lose some caster. it takes extra effort to turn the tires with lots of caster.since they axis isnt verticle, the tires are not pivoting on a fixed point like they would be with zero caster

since your driver side perch is not really moveable,put it together and quit stressing yourself out so much about it. if the caster is soooooooo far out of whack that its a prollem(wich it shouldnt be) a worse case scenario is youll have to pull the kunckles back off and rotate the inners to achieve your desired caster setting.

ive ground the knuckles off of several axles,and its really not that big a deal,i promise
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85 grand wagoneer
258/t18/d20/10 bolt/14 bolt
38" TSL SXs
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http://nightcrawlers4wd.20megsfree.com/index.html\

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Old 07-23-2003, 12:33 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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Im not using lift springs, but want to flip the spring eye to eye. This moves the axle forward about an inch or so, due to the fact that the pin is offset to the rear on Jeep springs. Now it's forward and slightly at an angle instead of straight down. I will get the housing bolted up today or soon, and see how it looks. I may just need a shim. Wil keep informed. Dennis
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Old 07-23-2003, 12:50 AM
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Scotty is right, get your front axle where you want it and don't worry that much about your pinion angle. If it looks decent go with it cuz you're not gonna be driving this baby much on the road anyways so it's not a big deal. Also, shims are ok, I wouldn't use more than 6 degrees. Make sure you get steel ones and I recommend welding them to the perch. Man you need to take progress pics cuz I can't wait to see this thing. It's gonna be so sweet. BTW, what engine you going with after all the trouble you've had.
-Andrew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by welchct
There are about 5 trails that actualy have section that are upwards of 85* and climb 40-50 feet at this deg.

"The combination of fine split tail and fine whiskey will make any man lose focus." -FSJeeper
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Old 07-23-2003, 04:37 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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I gonna run my rebuilt, rebuilt, rebuilt 360. The machine shop is about wrapped up with it. Im pretty sure the two Summit cams were crap. It appears that they had a bad run of cams from crane. It appears that the center journal is to large, causing it to come in contact with the lifter right behind that journal. And causing it to walk. We are gonna press Summit and crane, casue it a manufacturer defect, and can prove it.
I wish I could take pics along the way, but just have a dial up modem, and it take ten years to upload digital pics. Plus I don't have time to fart with it. I will get some detailed pics of my finished product.
I also looked at my axle for the u bolts. One of them like you say is gonna have to be bigger, cause of the housing. But it also has gossit running across the bottom. Did you grind a slot into that, for the ubolt to slide into? Dennis
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Old 07-23-2003, 04:43 AM
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There should already be a little valley in the bottom of the housing so the u-bolt can sit relatively flush but if there isn't, grinding one in isn't uncommon. Just make sure they fit flush and snug.
-Andrew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by welchct
There are about 5 trails that actualy have section that are upwards of 85* and climb 40-50 feet at this deg.

"The combination of fine split tail and fine whiskey will make any man lose focus." -FSJeeper
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  #11  
Old 07-23-2003, 01:36 PM
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just get it together sos i can meet ya in ky for some crawlin

[ July 23, 2003, 07:49 PM: Message edited by: scotty ]
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85 grand wagoneer
258/t18/d20/10 bolt/14 bolt
38" TSL SXs
chopped,bobbed and caged

http://nightcrawlers4wd.20megsfree.com/index.html\

http://mytrailrigs4x4.20megsfree.com/photo.html\
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  #12  
Old 07-23-2003, 01:49 PM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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Man, as soon as I get this and the engine done, Im gonna start cutting and shortening the frame. I might as well give up wheeling for the summer. Hopefully the frame deal will be quick. Im shooting for the middle of August. But your on for the crawlin. Maybe up around cinci/northern Ky area. Dennis
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Old 07-23-2003, 01:51 PM
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cool my trailer will be done within the next week,sos im itchin for a road trip.maybe you can ride shotgun if we make a trek down there in a month or so [img]smile.gif[/img]
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85 grand wagoneer
258/t18/d20/10 bolt/14 bolt
38" TSL SXs
chopped,bobbed and caged

http://nightcrawlers4wd.20megsfree.com/index.html\

http://mytrailrigs4x4.20megsfree.com/photo.html\
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  #14  
Old 07-23-2003, 02:02 PM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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Sounds good, but I plan on being done soon. Im getting a serious case of withdraws. I remember everyday, jumping in and running it through the creek and trails. I really miss that. And there are some real dumbass people around here who have chevy's jacked up with like 10" blocks, and I swear a few of them have them in the front. Anyway, they are always going past my house all dirty, and it kills me that I can't go show off my pride and joy And of course, smoke them on the hills and ruts.
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Old 07-25-2003, 01:48 AM
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I saw you may be selling your tires. Care to share what meats you're gonna slap in there?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by welchct
There are about 5 trails that actualy have section that are upwards of 85* and climb 40-50 feet at this deg.

"The combination of fine split tail and fine whiskey will make any man lose focus." -FSJeeper
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Old 07-25-2003, 02:54 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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If I could get what there worth, i'd get something like a 39.5 15/16 range tsl. Figure with the wider width axles, I might as well stuff some fatter tires under there. Dennis
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Old 07-25-2003, 02:56 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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Do you still have the claws for sale?
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Old 07-25-2003, 03:10 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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Out of curiousity, It looks like you could run like a 3.25 or even a 4" backspace and be OK? I have 4.25 rims, and am a good 2.5" from my rear leafs. The way I see things, going up to a tire that issay 3" wider, really only adds 1.5" each side of the tire, so a 3-4" bs would work. And the front appears to have plenty of room. Im just looking at your pics, and looking at the space you have, and what i have now.
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Old 07-25-2003, 04:23 AM
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Yea, they're still for sale. If you're interested in them I'll make you a good deal with or without the wheels. The wheels are 16x10 with 2.75in backspacing. Like you said that much backspacing isn't necessary but I like the extra width and I can definitely say I loved my width on the trail. My truck sidehills like crazy, is extremely stable, and the body stays off the rocks/ruts/trees. I wouldn't run a wheel with anything more than 3.5in backspacing in the woods personally. Also, they don't make the 39.5 TSL in a 16in rim. Only a 15in, 16.5, and a 17in coming soon. Something to consider.
-Andrew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by welchct
There are about 5 trails that actualy have section that are upwards of 85* and climb 40-50 feet at this deg.

"The combination of fine split tail and fine whiskey will make any man lose focus." -FSJeeper
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Old 07-25-2003, 05:51 AM
KYJ10 KYJ10 is offline
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emailed you!
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