TBI parts, source questions

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  • gte901m
    350 Buick
    • Jun 24, 2007
    • 1034

    #16
    Originally posted by travisrda
    about how much has the tbi conversion cost if you source everything from the pull--n-save?
    Here is what I spent on my tbi conversion:

    - wiring harness with computer and all sensor and knock module hooked to it - $15 the lady charged me for a "large wiring harnes"
    -tbi unit - $25
    - new fuel pump from summit racing $90
    - tbi adapter plate $45 from summit racing
    - new rubber fuel lines $40
    - chip burner, emulator, and datalogger combo from Moates.net $330
    - chip socket holder, extra chips, ZIF socket, other misc junk from Moates $50

    So I've got about $600 in it. You don't have to buy such an expensive burner setup though.
    Where are we going and why am I in this basket?

    Comment

    • JeepsAndGuns
      AMC 4 OH! 1
      • Jul 18, 2003
      • 4586

      #17
      Ok, swapping a plug wont be too bad, good to know.

      Ouch on the chip burner parts gte!...lol Cant afford that, gonna have to find someone to burn them for me.

      So are you guys running a VSS and a knock sensor? Reading through the binder link, it kinda looks like those are not really required. I have a manual trans.
      79 Cherokee Chief 401/T18/D20, MPFI fuel injection, hydroboost, otherwise stock.
      Future mods: Caddy 500/NV4500/NP205, HP D60 front D60 smooth botom rear, 5.13 gears, 35x12.50's on H1 beadlock wheels. Warn M12000 winch.
      93 Wrangler 4.6 stroker/AX15/NP231,SYE,CV, OME 2.5 lift, front hub conversion/big brakes, 31X10.50's Warn M10000 winch.

      Comment

      • jaber
        Dragin Az
        • Oct 17, 2003
        • 8104

        #18
        Heres a link to a guy in the vendor section here that will burn you chips to your engine specs....



        He quoted me $50 for a chip burned for a caddy motor.
        Jeff

        '43 cj2a
        '51 Willys p/u
        '51 Willys Parkway Conversion
        '68 Panel Delivery
        '74 CJ5
        '75 J-20 Wrecker
        '75 J-20 Cummins service bed
        '77 J-10 p/u
        '79 Cherokee
        '88 Grand Wagoneer
        '98 Grand Cherokee

        Comment

        • gte901m
          350 Buick
          • Jun 24, 2007
          • 1034

          #19
          I'm not running a VSS, but I am running a knock sensor.
          Where are we going and why am I in this basket?

          Comment

          • JeepsAndGuns
            AMC 4 OH! 1
            • Jul 18, 2003
            • 4586

            #20
            Thanks for the link jaber! I will keep him in mind.

            Is there a link or pics or anything I could use to know what and where I need to cut when pulling the harness out of the junkyard? Is it more or less a seperate harness that has only a few wires running into the main harness? Or is it all crazy tied together and I need to pull the whole underhood and underdash harness, then spend a day weeding it all out??
            79 Cherokee Chief 401/T18/D20, MPFI fuel injection, hydroboost, otherwise stock.
            Future mods: Caddy 500/NV4500/NP205, HP D60 front D60 smooth botom rear, 5.13 gears, 35x12.50's on H1 beadlock wheels. Warn M12000 winch.
            93 Wrangler 4.6 stroker/AX15/NP231,SYE,CV, OME 2.5 lift, front hub conversion/big brakes, 31X10.50's Warn M10000 winch.

            Comment

            • FSJ Guy
              • Mar 20, 2005
              • 10061

              #21
              If you go the budget route, a burner and an ALDL cable will only run you about $200. And that's figuring that you BUY a ready-made ALDL cable for $90 or so. You can make one yourself for about $20 and some soldering time.

              At $50 a chip, in four burns you have bought your burner and ALDL cable. And you will need an ALDL cable anyway. OK, you don't NEED to have it, but it sure is nice to monitor what's going on.

              Read ALL the information available on the Binder Planet forums, as well as this, my latest addition to my website: http://bigscaryjeep.com/TBI_FAQ.html
              Ethan Brady
              1987 Grand Wagoneer, slightly longer than stock.

              www.bigscaryjeep.com

              Don't mess with me. I once killed a living hinge.

              Comment

              • Chris P.
                350 Buick
                • Oct 12, 2003
                • 1307

                #22
                The harness is pretty much stand alone. There are a few power wires that will need to be cut and a few wires will need to be cut off of the bulkhead connector.

                I agree with FSJ Guy. You'll find it is a lot better if you can burn your own chips. You'll have the ability to quickly fine tune the bin to YOUR engine which is part of the key to getting good mileage.

                Like you said a knock sensor is optional, but it will help greatly when tuning in the spark table. If you take the time to add ignition control you might as well screw in a knock sensor.

                The VSS can help with mileage by cutting fuel when coasting. If you dont use a VSS, you might notice the idle speed dip and then catch itself when stopping and the fuel mixture will be rich when coating down hills.
                79 J10 Honcho 360/T-18/D20
                Summit 8600 cam, GM TBI
                78 Wagoneer 360/TH400/QT

                Comment

                • PlasticBoob
                  All Makes Combined
                  • Jun 30, 2003
                  • 4007

                  #23
                  Also, expect a 454 TBI to be considerably more expensive. I don't know about where you live, but out here one cannot just waltz in to any junkyard and expect to find a 350, let alone a 454. Most of the V8 Chevys in the yards here have 305s.

                  IIRC I had to blow around $125 for a 454 TBI on eBay.
                  Rob
                  1974 Cherokee S, fuel injected 401, Trans-am Red, Aussie locker 'out back'
                  Click for video

                  Comment

                  • PlasticBoob
                    All Makes Combined
                    • Jun 30, 2003
                    • 4007

                    #24
                    Originally posted by Chris P.
                    You'll find it is a lot better if you can burn your own chips. You'll have the ability to quickly fine tune the bin to YOUR engine which is part of the key to getting good mileage.
                    [content deleted - I no longer support MS]
                    Last edited by PlasticBoob; 03-17-2015, 03:50 PM.
                    Rob
                    1974 Cherokee S, fuel injected 401, Trans-am Red, Aussie locker 'out back'
                    Click for video

                    Comment

                    • FSJ Guy
                      • Mar 20, 2005
                      • 10061

                      #25
                      Wow! $125 for a 454 TBI? That's a steal! Nice score.

                      The AutoProm will let you emulate (tune on the fly), but yes, it is an expensive option.

                      Not trying to get into a GM vs. Megasquirt war here!
                      Ethan Brady
                      1987 Grand Wagoneer, slightly longer than stock.

                      www.bigscaryjeep.com

                      Don't mess with me. I once killed a living hinge.

                      Comment

                      • JeepsAndGuns
                        AMC 4 OH! 1
                        • Jul 18, 2003
                        • 4586

                        #26
                        I am planning on having to get a 454 TBI off ebay, yards around here are not gonna have one.

                        Ok, reading, and some of this stuff is not really explained what it is/what it does.
                        FI NOOB questions, :
                        ALDL What it stands for is on FSJ GUY's site, but still, just what is the cable for?
                        EEPROM??? huh?
                        bin files? same thing, HUH?
                        I need to learn this stuff.
                        79 Cherokee Chief 401/T18/D20, MPFI fuel injection, hydroboost, otherwise stock.
                        Future mods: Caddy 500/NV4500/NP205, HP D60 front D60 smooth botom rear, 5.13 gears, 35x12.50's on H1 beadlock wheels. Warn M12000 winch.
                        93 Wrangler 4.6 stroker/AX15/NP231,SYE,CV, OME 2.5 lift, front hub conversion/big brakes, 31X10.50's Warn M10000 winch.

                        Comment

                        • FSJ Guy
                          • Mar 20, 2005
                          • 10061

                          #27
                          Originally posted by JeepsAndGuns
                          I am planning on having to get a 454 TBI off ebay, yards around here are not gonna have one.

                          Ok, reading, and some of this stuff is not really explained what it is/what it does.
                          FI NOOB questions, :
                          ALDL What it stands for is on FSJ GUY's site, but still, just what is the cable for?
                          EEPROM??? huh?
                          bin files? same thing, HUH?
                          I need to learn this stuff.
                          Read up on all things TBI on the Binder Planet forums: http://www.binderplanet.com/forums/f...splay.php?f=75

                          ALDL: Assembly Line Diagnostic Link. This is what you plug your laptop into in order to monitor what the ECM (Engine Control Module) is doing. It is also the easiest way to pull trouble codes when your SES (Service Engine Soon) light comes on.

                          EEPROM: Electrically (or Electronic) Erasable Programable Read Only Memory. It's a non-volatile memory chip that can be erased and re-written electronically.

                          As opposed to an EPROM (Erasable Programable Read Only Memory), which is also a non-volatile memory chip, but it must be erased with UV (ultraviolet) light and this process can take several minutes. You can erase an EEPROM in several seconds.

                          The GM ECM in stock form takes a now obsolete memory chip, thus everyone "adapting" their ECMs to use the newer EEPROMs.
                          Ethan Brady
                          1987 Grand Wagoneer, slightly longer than stock.

                          www.bigscaryjeep.com

                          Don't mess with me. I once killed a living hinge.

                          Comment

                          • PlasticBoob
                            All Makes Combined
                            • Jun 30, 2003
                            • 4007

                            #28
                            Originally posted by FSJ Guy
                            Not trying to get into a GM vs. Megasquirt war here!
                            [content deleted - I no longer support MS]

                            And thanks, now I don't feel so bad about spending that much. I always hear people bragging about getting TBIs for like $10.
                            Last edited by PlasticBoob; 03-17-2015, 03:51 PM.
                            Rob
                            1974 Cherokee S, fuel injected 401, Trans-am Red, Aussie locker 'out back'
                            Click for video

                            Comment

                            • FSJ Guy
                              • Mar 20, 2005
                              • 10061

                              #29
                              Originally posted by PlasticBoob
                              And thanks, now I don't feel so bad about spending that much. I always hear people bragging about getting TBIs for like $10.
                              Well, you CAN. But then you have to replace the gaskets and seals ($30 kit), replace the IAC (~$30) and the TPS if it's bad ($60).

                              Now you have a $130 TBI!
                              Ethan Brady
                              1987 Grand Wagoneer, slightly longer than stock.

                              www.bigscaryjeep.com

                              Don't mess with me. I once killed a living hinge.

                              Comment

                              • JeepsAndGuns
                                AMC 4 OH! 1
                                • Jul 18, 2003
                                • 4586

                                #30
                                I am working my way through it as my brain allows it. Its a lot for someone new to absorb.

                                So if I'm reading it right, the original chip in the computer is EPROM, and the best to have is a EEPROM? That way I dont have to do that UV erase?
                                79 Cherokee Chief 401/T18/D20, MPFI fuel injection, hydroboost, otherwise stock.
                                Future mods: Caddy 500/NV4500/NP205, HP D60 front D60 smooth botom rear, 5.13 gears, 35x12.50's on H1 beadlock wheels. Warn M12000 winch.
                                93 Wrangler 4.6 stroker/AX15/NP231,SYE,CV, OME 2.5 lift, front hub conversion/big brakes, 31X10.50's Warn M10000 winch.

                                Comment

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