International Full Size Jeep Association
Home Forums Reader's Rigs Tech Library Trail Stories FSJ-List
International Full Size Jeep Association  

Go Back   International Full Size Jeep Association > Tire Kickin' > General FSJ Tech

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-27-2008, 04:14 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
Stalls when I take it out of park

90 360 stalls when I take it out of park. Any suggestions? Checked the vacuum lines, all seem ok. Must be a sensor? I've heard of a TVM (transmission vacuum something) but don't know much about it, obviously.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-27-2008, 05:31 PM
scantar's Avatar
scantar scantar is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 16, 2005
Location: OK Denver, dangit! :)
Posts: 4,296
Sounds like either a vac leak or an idle that's too low. Does it do it even if you're giving it gas before you shift?
__________________
'76 Waggy, TH400, Quadratrac and a fourOH!one Sold

My other car is a Viner Pro Team...no wait, my other car is a Masi Speciale...nonono, my other car is a Bianchi 928SL
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-27-2008, 05:52 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
Nope, doesn't do it at all until I start to put the shift lever into gear. It starts and runs very smoothly.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-27-2008, 05:56 PM
scantar's Avatar
scantar scantar is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Jul 16, 2005
Location: OK Denver, dangit! :)
Posts: 4,296
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcountryman
Nope, doesn't do it at all until I start to put the shift lever into gear. It starts and runs very smoothly.

No, I got that part...I meant does it stall out if you are giving it gas as you shift. IOW, if you keep the revs high can you shift out of park and into gear. Also, does it do the same thing if you start it in Neutral?
__________________
'76 Waggy, TH400, Quadratrac and a fourOH!one Sold

My other car is a Viner Pro Team...no wait, my other car is a Masi Speciale...nonono, my other car is a Bianchi 928SL
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-28-2008, 05:31 AM
aerocorey's Avatar
aerocorey aerocorey is offline
304 AMC
 
Join Date: Oct 14, 2006
Location: Evening Shade, MO
Posts: 2,036
Your 90 doesnt have anything vacuum on the transmission. That's a TH400 thing. It's a shift modulator. Your TF727 uses a mechanical linkage attached to the throttle to adjust shift points.
__________________
Corey

Current
87 GW "Big Bear"
76 J20 project "Ox"
90 GW parts rig "Velma"
77 J10 parts rig "NoMo" (as in "no more Jeeps, Corey!")
94 YJ "Coop"

Past
88 GW "Hercules" (had to sell in '08, curious who has it now)
83 Wag parts rig "Shaggy" (used to build Herc, then scrapped)
73 J4000 (had to sell due to PCS in '07)
75 Cherokee "Jerry Lee" (sold in '13 because I'm an idiot)
74 Cherokee "Dino" (used to build Jerry Lee, then scrapped)
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-28-2008, 07:50 AM
Ristow Ristow is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 20, 2006
Location: The Great Googley Moogley Midwest.
Posts: 17,170
you're lean. either by vacuum leak or carb adjustment.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hankrod
Ristows right.................again,




Quote:
Originally Posted by Fasts79Chief
... like the little 'you know what's' that you are.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Fasts79Chief
I LOVE how Ristow has stolen my comment about him ... "Quoted" it ... and made himself famous for being an ***hole to people. Hahahahahahahahahha!


→ Where the kids hang out...

fsjbuilder.org come for the mindless chat,stay for the hand drawn emoticons.

It's like you're unraveling a big cable-knit sweater that someone keeps knitting...and knitting...and knitting...and knitting...
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-28-2008, 09:35 AM
Chevelleguy's Avatar
Chevelleguy Chevelleguy is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 20, 2003
Location: Hughes Springs, TX
Posts: 5,565
If you have a lockup style trans, the converter clutch could be stuck. I have seen this multiple times in electronic transmissions where the torque converter clutch solenoid sticks and applies the clutch all the time.

I think the 727 lockup is applied mechanically, but something could still be malfunctioning.
__________________
David "If all else fails, read the instructions."
83 Wag Lt,BJ's 6"lift,360/727/Pinned229,D44/trac-lok,AMC20/lock-right,35/12.50 Baja MTZ,Pro-Jection EFI.
10$ NP229 fix http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=2520
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-28-2008, 12:08 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
Hmmmm--correction

I should have said, "it shuts off when I take it out of park or neutral". I tried any manner of iterations with the throttle and gear shift to get it to go into drive and not shut off. It seems like a switch problem. Engage=shut off.

The solenoid sticking seems like it could be the problem--any pointers to where I might find a diagram?
__________________
Julia Countryman
Member FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer (AKA The Tardis)
A few pics here: http://picasaweb.google.com/10040474...0764102/Waggy#
Building a new one, one part at a time
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-28-2008, 01:27 PM
aerocorey's Avatar
aerocorey aerocorey is offline
304 AMC
 
Join Date: Oct 14, 2006
Location: Evening Shade, MO
Posts: 2,036
http://oljeep.com/gw/elec/GW_wiring-1990.html
__________________
Corey

Current
87 GW "Big Bear"
76 J20 project "Ox"
90 GW parts rig "Velma"
77 J10 parts rig "NoMo" (as in "no more Jeeps, Corey!")
94 YJ "Coop"

Past
88 GW "Hercules" (had to sell in '08, curious who has it now)
83 Wag parts rig "Shaggy" (used to build Herc, then scrapped)
73 J4000 (had to sell due to PCS in '07)
75 Cherokee "Jerry Lee" (sold in '13 because I'm an idiot)
74 Cherokee "Dino" (used to build Jerry Lee, then scrapped)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-28-2008, 01:36 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
Thanks Corey--any idea which diagram is the one that I want? I don't know where torque converter clutch solenoid is mounted.
__________________
Julia Countryman
Member FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer (AKA The Tardis)
A few pics here: http://picasaweb.google.com/10040474...0764102/Waggy#
Building a new one, one part at a time
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-28-2008, 03:47 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
Thanks Corey--any idea which diagram is the one that I want? I don't know where torque converter clutch solenoid is mounted.
__________________
Julia Countryman
Member FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer (AKA The Tardis)
A few pics here: http://picasaweb.google.com/10040474...0764102/Waggy#
Building a new one, one part at a time
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-28-2008, 10:17 PM
aerocorey's Avatar
aerocorey aerocorey is offline
304 AMC
 
Join Date: Oct 14, 2006
Location: Evening Shade, MO
Posts: 2,036
It's in the transmission bellhousing. I don't know which diagram you want. I've never messed with the '90 diagrams and I don't have an electric lockup converter. If you don't have wires going into your transmission bellhousing somewhere than neither do you...
__________________
Corey

Current
87 GW "Big Bear"
76 J20 project "Ox"
90 GW parts rig "Velma"
77 J10 parts rig "NoMo" (as in "no more Jeeps, Corey!")
94 YJ "Coop"

Past
88 GW "Hercules" (had to sell in '08, curious who has it now)
83 Wag parts rig "Shaggy" (used to build Herc, then scrapped)
73 J4000 (had to sell due to PCS in '07)
75 Cherokee "Jerry Lee" (sold in '13 because I'm an idiot)
74 Cherokee "Dino" (used to build Jerry Lee, then scrapped)
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-29-2008, 08:58 AM
aatcman's Avatar
aatcman aatcman is offline
258 I6
 
Join Date: Apr 10, 2006
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 281
Non-electronic engine = no sensors.

Please define "Shuts Off"

Is it an instant thing, like you just threw a wrench into it or is it graceful, like if you turned off the ignition?

You say you can't go into gear from park or neutral. Have you tried both reverse AND drive from neutral? Could be an eletrical thing with the reverse lights.

If its instant (like something in the engine hits a brick wall, i.e. you hear a slam or it just stops dead without spin down) you have a transmission problem.

Otherwise, you are probably looking for something either electrical or involved with the movement of the gear shift -- like a wire that gets touched or something along those lines.

It could be a fuel mix thing -- but in that case, if you hold the revs up while shifting into gear, it should go -- but not neccessarily happily.

Try starting the engine, then stepping on the brakes -- if that kills the engine, replace all four bulbs in the rear fixtures (1157). This type of bulb can cause all sorts of problems when it burns out because the burnt out filament can contact the second filament and short circuits together that are not supposed to interact.

Try holding the ignition key turned slightly past run when shifting into gear. If that keeps the engine running, you just need to adjust the ignition switch OR, if the column wobbles, tighten up the column (search for other posts on that if needed -- good info on this website for that). Ignition switch is a small box on the column, just past the dash -- its held on with a few screws -- just loosen screws and slide up and down the column until it works right.

Try setting the 4WD lever to 4WD (or 2WD if its already in 4WD). If this helps, then your vacuum shift motor is shot (BJs offroad has them).

Try letting the engine warm up completly before shifting -- if this works, you have a choke problem -- there are two metal tubes going to the passenger side of the carburetor. They are probably rotted -- I fixed mine with JB weld 8 years ago.

Hope this helps
__________________
Just my 2 Cents (Good grief!! Even my weedeater laughs at me now!! Silly gas prices!)

1986 Grand Wagoneer (225xxx)

1988 Comanche Pioneer (215xxx)
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-29-2008, 02:34 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
I'll give those a shot--thanks!

When it shuts off, it's like I turned off the ignition and no slamming involved, so I don't think it's the tranny. The first time it did it, it ran a little rough for a while, then I went ahead and let it run for about 20 minutes, then it was fine when I put it into gear. It did it again the next morning when it was completely cold, although not as bad.

Now that I'm home, (read SNOW), letting it run made no difference (it was 18 F outside), so either whatever was breaking, broke more, or it just never got warm enough to overcome the issue.
There was a vacuum line that had broken, so we fixed that, but that didn't fix the problem and was probably why it was running rough.

The steering column does have a bit of play in it--will check that too.
__________________
Julia Countryman
Member FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer (AKA The Tardis)
A few pics here: http://picasaweb.google.com/10040474...0764102/Waggy#
Building a new one, one part at a time
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-29-2008, 08:10 PM
letank's Avatar
letank letank is offline
AMC 4 OH! 1
 
Join Date: Jun 03, 2002
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 3,896
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ristow
you're lean. either by vacuum leak or carb adjustment.

your accelerator pump, the plastic diaphragm that is in the front and forward housing of the carburetor is not doing its job.... you are too lean... and the lack of power makes the engine stalls when all that oil in the transmission is added to the circuit.

Usually small and rapid taps on the accelerator help as soon as you shift.... accelerating before shifting in D is too rough on the transmission... but for a one time try..... we won't tell. Otherwise you could try to increase the idle speed.
__________________
Michel
74 wag, 349Kmiles on original ticker/trany, except for the rust. Will it make it to the next get together without a rebuilt? Status: needs a new body.
85 Gwag, 226 Kmiles. $250 FSJ test lab since 02, that refuses to give up but still leaks.

See Ouray 2013, Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-29-2008, 11:08 PM
mimmp mimmp is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 01, 2008
Location: Space Coast, Florida
Posts: 182
Check the timing.
__________________
FWIW, YMMV, EIEIO
'87 Grand Wagoneer, '73 Commando

C.S.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-01-2009, 02:30 PM
amc75matador's Avatar
amc75matador amc75matador is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Dec 28, 2004
Location: Where the grass is white, Upstate NY
Posts: 975
My 79 cher does this when I first start it up, shift in to drive it stalls. restart and shift again with a little throttle and it's fine.
__________________
Sleep, Eat, Jeep, Repeat...
"I need Another Jeep!"
"The streets will flood with the blood of the non-believers!"
"Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most!"
"Nothing makes a person more productive than the last minute"
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-04-2009, 03:21 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
Here's a new twist--tried the obvious things, and in thinking back to the first day it did it, I let it sit and run (runs fine) for about a half an hour, put it in drive and drove away just fine.
Next morning, same scenario.
__________________
Julia Countryman
Member FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer (AKA The Tardis)
A few pics here: http://picasaweb.google.com/10040474...0764102/Waggy#
Building a new one, one part at a time
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 04-27-2009, 04:45 PM
jcountryman's Avatar
jcountryman jcountryman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: california
Posts: 35
It's Electrical Baby!

I started goofing around with my waggy today after months of snow, cold weather and not wanting to deal with the frustration. I was letting it run and goofing around with the windows and rolled the rear window up and down then up again. I then pushed the up side of the switch and the engine shut off. I repeated this about 10-15 times with the same result every time. Then with the engine off, but the key on, I played with the switch again--big voltage cuts each time I put it in the UP position with the window up.

My guess is that some mouse has been using insulation for its nest.

Where should I look first for a broken or shorted wire--in the dash or under the hood? Is there anything else that I should look for?
__________________
Julia Countryman
Member FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer (AKA The Tardis)
A few pics here: http://picasaweb.google.com/10040474...0764102/Waggy#
Building a new one, one part at a time
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 04-28-2009, 05:10 PM
aatcman's Avatar
aatcman aatcman is offline
258 I6
 
Join Date: Apr 10, 2006
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 281
Under the hood.

Sounds to me like you've either got some wire being pressed against the exhaust by the shifter linkage (lever sticking out of the steering shaft, moves when the gear selector is moved), OR you have a fusible link going on you (rubber looking flags or warts on the wires, about 4-6 inches from the starter solenoid).

Alternatively, you could have a shot ignition switch. Try moving the rear window up and down from the key swich on the tailgate -- if that does NOT have the same effect the dash switch does, then I'd bet on the ignition switch. IF the key switch DOES cause the same problems, then I would look at the fusible links.

Hope this helps
__________________
Just my 2 Cents (Good grief!! Even my weedeater laughs at me now!! Silly gas prices!)

1986 Grand Wagoneer (225xxx)

1988 Comanche Pioneer (215xxx)
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:29 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
corner corner